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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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Pre Release profiles |
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| Registered: May 20, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 2,934 |
| | Posted: | | | | I have to question some of the submissions for DVD Pre-release info.
1. Does it make any since to update a Profile image, when the DVD/BD hasn't been released yet. Taking images from DVD/BD info sites (aside from promotional pictures initially) seems to be, unnecessary at best. (Considering, they will all change at release)
2. Cast/Crew entries. Does it not violate the rules to take cast and crew from third party sites, when it is known that the DVD/BD release will have the list included on disc?
Aside from the initial promo poster image, cast/crew from the poster, and the release date and maybe a projected SRP, should most other information be restricted until the DVD/BD is actually released?
Charlie |
| | Registered: May 13, 2007 | | Reputation: |  Posts: 54 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting CharlieM: Quote:
Aside from the initial promo poster image, cast/crew from the poster, and the release date and maybe a projected SRP, should most other information be restricted until the DVD/BD is actually released? It often depends upon where the pre-release information comes from. Some of the release companies (labels) offer high quality and accurate online information on forthcoming releases that accurately reflect the product that finally hits the shelf. Online retailers though are notorious for their inaccurate pre-release data, and a pre-release profile needs to be completely revised when it's finally released. Personally, the main problem I find with pre-release profiles is that individuals who submit them often regularly fail to update them, leaving the 'hard work' for others to do. The database is full of titles that are nothing more than pre-release submissions that have simply been left at that. |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 2,293 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting analogueman: Quote:
Personally, the main problem I find with pre-release profiles is that individuals who submit them often regularly fail to update them, leaving the 'hard work' for others to do. To be fair I often put in pre-release 'basic' submissions but then don't actually buy them until the price drops some 6months later... it's not necessarily laziness you know! Also, the big advantage with having a pre-release submission is that when it is released people can see any updates for voting rather than having 3 or 4 people submitting profiles at the same time not knowing what anyone else is doing. | | | | It is dangerous to be right in matters where established men are wrong | | | | Last edited: by Voltaire53 |
| | Registered: May 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 54 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Voltaire53: Quote:
Quoting analogueman:
Quote:
Personally, the main problem I find with pre-release profiles is that individuals who submit them often regularly fail to update them, leaving the 'hard work' for others to do.
To be fair I often put in pre-release 'basic' submissions but then don't actually buy them until the price drops some 6months later... it's not necessarily laziness you know! Oh sure - I was speaking loosely rather than having a pop at all pre-release submissions. I have followed this up on several titles recently though, where the original pre-release contribution was perhaps three or four years ago, the original contributer does own the title (as seen in their online collection), and when I've completely updated everything from Overview to correct Release Date, I had a friendly comment in the yes vote from the said individual saying "thanks - I really didn't have the time to do this myself".  Quoting Voltaire53: Quote:
Also, the big advantage with having a pre-release submission is that when it is released people can see any updates for voting rather than having 3 or 4 people submitting profiles at the same time not knowing what anyone else is doing. Oh indeed, I've no problems with pre-release contributions (I submit enough of them myself), for the reasons you give. I just wish more people would commit themselves to updating their pre-release contributions when they finally do buy the title. |
| | Registered: May 19, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 6,730 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting CharlieM: Quote:
1. Does it make any since to update a Profile image, when the DVD/BD hasn't been released yet. Taking images from DVD/BD info sites (aside from promotional pictures initially) seems to be, unnecessary at best. (Considering, they will all change at release)
2. Cast/Crew entries. Does it not violate the rules to take cast and crew from third party sites, when it is known that the DVD/BD release will have the list included on disc? Question 1): No, it doesn't make any sense. But it doesn't do any harm either ... Question 2): Yupp, adding Cast/Crew data from third party material violates the rules. That's why Pre-Release contributions should only contain the most basic data. Sadly this sometimes gets neglected. | | | It all seems so stupid, it makes me want to give up!
But why should I give up, when it all seems so stupid?
Registrant since 05/22/2003 | | | | Last edited: by Lewis_Prothero |
| | Registered: May 20, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 2,934 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting analogueman: Quote:
It often depends upon where the pre-release information comes from.
Some of the release companies (labels) offer high quality and accurate online information on forthcoming releases that accurately reflect the product that finally hits the shelf. Online retailers though are notorious for their inaccurate pre-release data, and a pre-release profile needs to be completely revised when it's finally released.
Personally, the main problem I find with pre-release profiles is that individuals who submit them often regularly fail to update them, leaving the 'hard work' for others to do. The database is full of titles that are nothing more than pre-release submissions that have simply been left at that. On the surface this all sounds well and good, though the rules tell us that the information is to come from the disc or the packaging (for most things). So in the end, it really doesn't matter how good the info is from any third party site, contribution of that info is against the rules. I like having pre release profiles. The only question that I have, is why go through the effort of updating information that the rules tell us to take from the Disc or packaging, when the disc/packaging is not in hand, considering this information is incorrect (for our purposes) most of the time. Charlie |
| | Registered: May 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 54 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting CharlieM: Quote:
On the surface this all sounds well and good, though the rules tell us that the information is to come from the disc or the packaging (for most things). So in the end, it really doesn't matter how good the info is from any third party site, contribution of that info is against the rules. I think if we rigidly stuck to the rules, as you mention above, then pre-release contributions would all but vanish because if you don't actually have the product 'in your hand' (as reference) the only place the information can come from is third party sites. In reality, a sizable proportion of pre-release contributions (which don't necessarily adhere to the rules upon the initial contribution) are correctly updated when the title is released and people use the disc/packaging as the rules state we should. I too like having pre-release profiles - even though the content doesn't always strictly conform to the rules. |
| | Registered: June 21, 2007 | Reputation:  | | Posts: 2,621 |
| | Posted: | | | | I'd say it's fine to add cast and crew to these IF: You have seen the movie in theaters and recall some of the cast or crew, throw them on! Like adding Johnny Depp for a pre-release of Pirates 4 is a no-brainer! You have seen the trailer and can see cast there, throw it on with a link to the trailer for verification. You loved the movie so much you went back and recorded it on your phone, and can somehow make out the credits. You need help, but rock on! I'd say an offical website for the movie should have good info as well, pretty much anything else is gonna at least bend a rule.  |
|   | Eagle | | Registered: Oct 31, 2001 |
| Registered: March 15, 2007 | | Posts: 563 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting CharlieM: Quote:
I have to question some of the submissions for DVD Pre-release info.
1. Does it make any since to update a Profile image, when the DVD/BD hasn't been released yet. Taking images from DVD/BD info sites (aside from promotional pictures initially) seems to be, unnecessary at best. (Considering, they will all change at release)
2. Cast/Crew entries. Does it not violate the rules to take cast and crew from third party sites, when it is known that the DVD/BD release will have the list included on disc?
Aside from the initial promo poster image, cast/crew from the poster, and the release date and maybe a projected SRP, should most other information be restricted until the DVD/BD is actually released?
Charlie 1. IMHO, I would much rather see coverart, even if it's not the final artwork, as opposed to the generic "no image" file. Since new, final coverart will be scanned anyways once the title has been released, I see no harm in the pre-release coverart. 2. In all the pre-release contributions I've done, I've almost never contributed any cast or crew, for just the reason you mention. Most of the time I did contribute it, I got the info from official press release info that was provided to the theater I worked at when the film was released theatrically, and I documented this. There may have been a few times where I contributed just director info where it was well known, but I can probably count on 1 hand how many times I've done this. | | | | My phpDVDprofiler collection |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  | | Posts: 17,334 |
| | Posted: | | | | Mostly the only time I add cast to a pre-release is to a TV series... adding the starring cast of the series... not the guest cast. That waits till I can check the credits. I just recently put in a pre-release profile for a TV Series set where I have the main cast within the episode dividers for all the episodes. Which can be verified at many sites including the official site for the show... and then when it is released and I have the set it will be so much less work to add the guest stars and extras. | | | | Pete |
| | Registered: May 20, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 2,934 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Eagle: Quote:
1. IMHO, I would much rather see coverart, even if it's not the final artwork, as opposed to the generic "no image" file. Since new, final coverart will be scanned anyways once the title has been released, I see no harm in the pre-release coverart.
2. In all the pre-release contributions I've done, I've almost never contributed any cast or crew, for just the reason you mention. Most of the time I did contribute it, I got the info from official press release info that was provided to the theater I worked at when the film was released theatrically, and I documented this. There may have been a few times where I contributed just director info where it was well known, but I can probably count on 1 hand how many times I've done this. I to would rather see a cover art of some sort. The issue I have is people update that initial coverart, to something they feel is better, and put it up for contribution voting. I think pre-release should be limited to an initial contribution (Image, SRP Estimated arrival, and very very basic cast crew information), with SRP and release updated as updated from the distributor until release date, or until the disc is in hand. Charlie |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 17,334 |
| | Posted: | | | | I have no problem with people trying to update pre-release cover-art with something better. I have done it myself on several occasions. In my case there was many times I updated a pre-release 3-D cover art with the just front image cover art as the rules are against 3D cover art as they are written as it shows the spine. And the spine showing on a either front or back cover art is against the rules. With no exception for 3D cover art. So I believe that to be a correct contribution no matter if the release is out there or not.
And I have also went from (almost) thumbnail image to bigger (or full sized) image if I find one that can be used. And once again... see no problem with such submissions... even thankful to see them.
Pretty much any and all correct (and within rules) submissions I am more then happy to see whether it is a pre-release or a release that is already out.
After all... as long as it is correct... why would I care? I wouldn't care if a profile is updated every single day up to the release... as long as the new info is correct and within the rules. | | | | Pete |
| | Eagle | | Registered: Oct 31, 2001 |
| Registered: March 15, 2007 | | Posts: 563 |
| | Posted: | | | | I was actually just contemplating updating a pre-release title. The movie is Rio, set for release on Aug 2. The existing DVD profile has the title as "Rio" and coverart to match. The BD/DVD combo profile has the title as "Rio: The Movie", again with coverart to match. I looked at the press release for this title last night and the title "Rio: The Movie" is nowhere to be found...it's referred to as it's correct title of "Rio" and even has coverart reflecting this. Amazon lists the title as "Rio" but shows the "Rio: The Movie" coverart for both the DVD & BD/DVD versions. DVDEmpire shows everything as just "Rio" all the way around, as does news site DVDActive. The press release can be found: here. My first thought when I added Rio to my wishlist was: why are they changing the title...Rio: The Movie just sounds ridiculous. My guess, and it's just a guess, is that Rio: The Movie was a working title for the video release, but since the press release just goes by Rio, that the studio decided against the modified title. | | | | My phpDVDprofiler collection | | | | Last edited: by Eagle |
| | Registered: May 16, 2010 | | Reputation: |  Posts: 516 |
| | Posted: | | | | Here in Europe we are most of the time behind the States. F.e. a film is sold in the States often 1 or 2 month before we get in in Europe (Germany/Switzerland). So for a pre-release contribution it is often possible to take the cast and crew from an approved US profile. That is the one way to have cast and crew already in a pre-release contribution. The other: I often contribute Blu-ray releases from films that are out on DVD since a long time and now come out on Blu-ray. Also here I take the cast and crew from the approved DVD in the pre-release contribution. That sounds OK, yes? | | | *
3D TV Panasonic TX-P65VT30J + Blu-ray Player Panasonic DMP-BDT500
My Filmcollection online: www.filmkino.ch
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| | Registered: May 19, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 6,730 |
| | Posted: | | | | It is OK, yes.
Even though I personally prefer to take the data from the BluRay/DVD itself.
But there's nothing to say against your procedure. | | | It all seems so stupid, it makes me want to give up!
But why should I give up, when it all seems so stupid?
Registrant since 05/22/2003 |
| | Registered: May 16, 2010 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 516 |
| | Posted: | | | | Thanks, Silence_of_Lambs :-). I also forgot to mention the case where you rent a disc. You can rent them often some weeks before they are sold. Then you can contribute the cast and crew from the rental disc also it is not sold yet, this is another case to have even in a pre-release already cast and crew. | | | *
3D TV Panasonic TX-P65VT30J + Blu-ray Player Panasonic DMP-BDT500
My Filmcollection online: www.filmkino.ch
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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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