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  Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler iOS: iOS Feature Requests Page: 1 2 3 4 5  Previous   Next
I give up (Locked)
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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorSpaceFreakMicha
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Registered: March 13, 2007
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Just found this: 

 Last edited: by SpaceFreakMicha
DVD Profiler Unlimited Registrantjmskywalker76
Damn the EmpireFREEMEDIA
Registered: October 28, 2008
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This is in no way meant as a knock on Ken and the tremendous amount of effort and time he has put into the app that we have we have yet to see the product.  We all love the product DVD Profiler, however, the OP does indeed bring possible valid points.  I feel bad that he got slammed by so many. 

The fact is it was in fact, long ago mentioned that a version of DVD Profiler was coming to the iPhone and a version of DVD Profiler does exist for the now somewhat technologically past its prime Window's Mobile, because, I would guess, it was much more easily compatible.  I know Apple makes it difficult to get apps onto their devices, so I certainly sympathize with developers.  I know it can't be easy to start at ground zero to bring DVD Profiler to a new platform.  There has been basically little to no update as to what has been going on with the project.  So, it is easy to see, why in the eyes of the OP, it would seem that Invelos is missing the boat.  I'm not saying he's right, but, the fact is there that it was announced, there was no movement, the app market/movement has exploded and in that time there was a new version of DVD Profiler for Windows Mobile. 

The secondary fact is we don't know what the finished product will be.  Ken doesn't give us much in the way of communication or updates.  We know that supposedly, iPhone/iPad/iPod touch version will be a pseudo replacement for the desktop version.  The OP was simply stating that these are things that based on the capabilities of the devices should be included.  Ken has indicated, prior to, the OP's posting that it would basically be a replacement, but it was a bit vague I thought.  In the end, we won't know until we have a finished product. 

The OP went on a rant.  He had some valid gripes.  Sure, maybe he should have read all the threads and been a little more informed before he posted, but honestly, haven't most of us made that mistake before?  I know I sure have commented on things only to find out, there has already been a thread answering my question or covering my topic.  The real world sucks enough; we should at least try to keep this one a little better.  LOL
If you find yourself with nothing to watch, you are no lover of film.
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile Registrantjohnd
Evening, poetry lovers.
Registered: March 13, 2007
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Time to close this thread. It's just a distraction now.
DVD Profiler Unlimited Registrantleaff
Registered: May 16, 2009
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Thanks jmskywalker76. I think your the only person who actually read my post. I was hoping it would generate a frank discussion about the need for the iPhone app not to be like the desktop but instead this thread is proof that there are too many here who aren't interested in this type of discussion.

The only type of discussion allowed seems to be grateful cheerleader type posts that thank Ken when he decides to throw us some crumbs.

I don't know anything about Ken his life or what motivates him. All I know is he has a website offering a product for sale that he's decided to sell for a price and conditions decided by him and I don't owe him anything more or less. Don't care if he's alone or has fifty employees, don't care if he's poor or filthy rich. All I know is if he's only prepared to listen to his cheerleaders, his product will suffer and his sales will drop and we'll all move on to a better product. I think the same thing is starting to happen to Microsoft so he's in good
company. Google and Apple seem to be the players now. In my thirty plus years of following this industry, I have never seen a shift in app development than for the iPhone. Even game developers are noticing the shift.  People are buying iTouch for their kids because the games are ten bucks instead of sixty for the XBox or the PS.  Maybe in ten years well all be using DVD library running on our iPhone7 and Microsoft, DVD Profiler and desktops will only be a distant memory. As I said ignore the iPhone apps potential to your detriment.
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorTheMadMartian
Alien with an attitude
Registered: March 13, 2007
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Quoting leaff:
Quote:
Thanks jmskywalker76. I think your the only person who actually read my post. I was hoping it would generate a frank discussion about the need for the iPhone app not to be like the desktop but instead this thread is proof that there are too many here who aren't interested in this type of discussion.

If that is what you were after, maybe you shouldn't have made a post in the form of a single, whining, complaint that made little sense.  Your message, if there was one, was lost in the format.
Quote:
All I know is if he's only prepared to listen to his cheerleaders, his product will suffer and his sales will drop and we'll all move on to a better product. I think the same thing is starting to happen to Microsoft so he's in good company.

What sales drop?  Worldwide PC sales, for Q1 2010, were 81.7 million units, which was a 25.8% growth.  Of that  81.7 million, only 2.94 million were Macs.  Yes, that was a 33% increase, but it's still only 3.6% of the PC market.
Quote:
Google and Apple seem to be the players now.

In the smartphone market, sure, but even there Apple is slipping.  As of the end of Q1 2010, Android captured 28% of the smartphone market, while the iPhone took 21%.  What makes these numbers important is the fact that, as of February 2010, Androind had 9% compared to iPhone's 25.4%.
Quote:
Even game developers are noticing the shift.  People are buying iTouch for their kids because the games are ten bucks instead of sixty for the XBox or the PS.

Actually, people are buying the various DS systems for their kids, not the iTouch.  I deal with kids on a daily basis and not a single one uses the iTouch as a gaming system.
Quote:
Maybe in ten years well all be using DVD library running on our iPhone7 and Microsoft, DVD Profiler and desktops will only be a distant memory. As I said ignore the iPhone apps potential to your detriment.

Based on current sales trends, not some ficticious 'maybe', it's the Android app that makes the most sense.
No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar
 Last edited: by TheMadMartian
DVD Profiler Unlimited Registrantleaff
Registered: May 16, 2009
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Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
Quoting leaff:
Quote:
Thanks jmskywalker76. I think your the only person who actually read my post. I was hoping it would generate a frank discussion about the need for the iPhone app not to be like the desktop but instead this thread is proof that there are too many here who aren't interested in this type of discussion.

If that is what you were after, maybe you shouldn't have made a post in the form of a single, whining, complaint that made little sense.  Your message, if there was one, was lost in the format.


Sorry I will use only short simple sentences in future posts so you can grasp the meaning.

Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:

Quote:
All I know is if he's only prepared to listen to his cheerleaders, his product will suffer and his sales will drop and we'll all move on to a better product. I think the same thing is starting to happen to Microsoft so he's in good company.

What sales drop?  Worldwide PC sales, for Q1 2010, were 81.7 million units, which was a 25.8% growth.  Of that  81.7 million, only 2.94 million were Macs.  Yes, that was a 33% increase, but it's still only 3.6% of the PC market.


I should have said a drop in sale projections. Trends indicate a shift to tablets and smartphones for many of the traditional uses of desktops and laptops which has promoted a new interface and a new way of interacting with computers. The tablet manufacturers have underestimated the growth in tablets sales and are expecting Christmas shortages due to shortages in components. I don't disagree that Macs are a small part of that market. They suffer the same plight as the PC but at least Apple has a foot in the emerging tablet and smartphone market. As of yet I don't see PC in that market. Also if they do emerge will they be a copycat or a real contender.

Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:

Quote:
Google and Apple seem to be the players now.

In the smartphone market, sure, but even there Apple is slipping.  As of the end of Q1 2010, Android captured 28% of the smartphone market, while the iPhone took 21%.  What makes these numbers important is the fact that, as of February 2010, Androind had 9% compared to iPhone's 25.4%.


Sorry again I thought Google owned Android. It is clear that Android with its open platform will probably win the race but I feel I have benefited from Apples closed system as I wouldn't feel comfortable mistakenly downloading a rogue app that has access to my cell phone. Once again Apple will probably loose in the end due to its closed mentality.

Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:

Quote:
Even game developers are noticing the shift.  People are buying iTouch for their kids because the games are ten bucks instead of sixty for the XBox or the PS.

Actually, people are buying the various DS systems for their kids, not the iTouch.  I deal with kids on a daily basis and not a single one uses the iTouch as a gaming system.


I don't deal with kids so I can't rely on limited anecdotal experience. I have to rely on experts in the field that follow these things and since the economic downfall the trend is to buying used games and games on portable devices. If you think that portable devices aren't going to be serious gaming platforms check this out http://www.physorg.com/news201175168.html and http://www.tested.com/news/have-smart-phones-already-won-the-handheld-gaming-war/727/. This article also talks about trends in games for toddlers http://www.cbc.ca/technology/story/2010/09/17/f-videogames-future-toddler-games.html

Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:

Quote:
Maybe in ten years well all be using DVD library running on our iPhone7 and Microsoft, DVD Profiler and desktops will only be a distant memory. As I said ignore the iPhone apps potential to your detriment.

Based on current sales trends, not some ficticious 'maybe', it's the Android app that makes the most sense.

Based on your answer it is clear that you're only interest is to disagree with all my comments for the sake of disagreeing, that you don't intended on ever having a constructive discussion. Your world is divided into those I'm against and those I'm for regardless of the arguments presented. In actual fact you have in a round about way confirmed and proved almost all my arguments. The only difference is that my comments were made in the context of the missing DVD Pro iPhone app and yours made a point of avoiding this context.
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile Registrantjohnd
Evening, poetry lovers.
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Quoting leaff:
Quote:
Sorry again I thought Google owned Android. It is clear that Android with its open platform will probably win the race but I feel I have benefited from Apples closed system as I wouldn't feel comfortable mistakenly downloading a rogue app that has access to my cell phone. Once again Apple will probably loose in the end due to its closed mentality.


Just to clear up some misconceptions:

Android is not a phone. You cannot buy Android. All you can buy are various implementations of Android by various phone makers on various hardware platforms. Saying "I'm buying an Android phone" is the equivalent of saying "I'm buying an internal combustion engine car".

Android may be open, but there is currently no "open" implementation of Android on any phone. All are closed systems. Try to update your Android-based phone to the lastest version of Android. Without going though lots of hoops, you are dependent on when the carrier (not even the hardware maker) decides (if ever) to make it availiable to you.

Apple is actually a more "open" system than Android, as it is controlled by the hardware maker, rather than the carrier. For instance, I don't have to wait for Telstra to approve my iPhone software update and then give it to me. In Apple's world, carriers are forced to keep up with the latest software version. In the Android world, carriers can stop you getting the update if they feel they need to sell you a new phone to improve their bottom line.
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorTheMadMartian
Alien with an attitude
Registered: March 13, 2007
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On second thought, it really isn't worth it.
No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar
 Last edited: by TheMadMartian
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorTheMadMartian
Alien with an attitude
Registered: March 13, 2007
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Quoting johnd:
Quote:
Apple is actually a more "open" system than Android, as it is controlled by the hardware maker, rather than the carrier.

I think he meant 'open' in that anybody can write, and release, an app for the Android OS while anything written for the iOS has to go through Apple.
No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
Registered: March 20, 2007
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Quoting johnd:
Quote:
Apple is actually a more "open" system than Android, as it is controlled by the hardware maker, rather than the carrier.

Of course.  One hardware manufacturer, one carrier, and one app store.

Apple is just all about openness.   

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 Last edited: by scotthm
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile Registrantjohnd
Evening, poetry lovers.
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Quoting scotthm:
Quote:

Of course.  One hardware manufacturer, one carrier, and one app store.

Apple is just all about openness.   

---------------


One hardware manufacturer means platform consistency, something Android as a OS can't provide.

One carrier????  Only in the warped telecomunications industry in the US. In Australia I can buy an iPhone and connect it to any carrier I like, even ones that don't sell hardware at all.

One app store. How, exactly, is this a problem? I suppose the small number of apps and lack of choice in the iTunes store might be a problem 
I want my apps to be vetted to make sure they don't stuff up the phone. This is something Google is working towards, but hasn't yet solved. And probably won't be able to. Multiple app stores means multiple levels of trust. We have already seen that Android app stores range from good to ones full of malware and poorly QC'ed apps. On top of that, some carriers are attempting to lock ANdroid phone users into their own apps stores only. Hardly an "open" philosophy.

And then there is the issue of carriers selling Android based phones full of crap carrier apps that you can't remove. In Australia, carriers can add apps to the iPhone if you buy it through them, but they can't stop you removing them.

You need to look at the whole package. Google has created and released an open phone platform into a world where phone makers and carriers don't want that. The only advantage they see with Android is that they no longer have to pay to develop the base code. They are not interested in providing an "open" platform to their customers, as they want to lock you in to a system that makes you buy a new phone if you want the new version of Android.
 Last edited: by johnd
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorTheMadMartian
Alien with an attitude
Registered: March 13, 2007
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.
No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar
 Last edited: by TheMadMartian
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
Registered: March 20, 2007
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Quoting johnd:
Quote:
One hardware manufacturer means platform consistency, something Android as a OS can't provide.

True, but it's got nothing to do with being "open".

Quote:
One carrier????  Only in the warped telecomunications industry in the US.

The fact that Apple has entered into an exclusive carrier agreement anywhere disproves your claim of "openness".

Quote:
One app store. How, exactly, is this a problem?

It presents no problem to me, but it's hardly the hallmark of an "open" company.

To summarize, Apple is not "open" in any way, shape, or form, no matter what the shortcomings of the Android OS and Google are.

---------------
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile Registrantjohnd
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Quoting scotthm:
Quote:

The fact that Apple has entered into an exclusive carrier agreement anywhere disproves your claim of "openness".


Nope. It just an abberation of the US telecommunications industry. The fact that Apple is currently looking at a sim design that allows you to change your carrier on-the-fly demonstrates that they are not happy with what they were forced to do to enter the mobile phone field. (And, no, the idea hasn't been scuttled by the carriers. They just wish the idea would go away).

Quote:
One app store. How, exactly, is this a problem?

Quote:
It presents no problem to me, but it's hardly the hallmark of an "open" company.


Since anyone can develop apps and submit them to the store, I would hardly call it closed.

You see, like so many people you have fallen for the "religious" argument that somehow phones built on Android represent some sort of "open" ideal, while phones built on a OS platform that is managed and demands adherance to certain standards and quaility, that anyone can develop for provided they adhere to those standards and quality, is somehow bad.

In the end, the vast majority of users do not select their phone based on some measure of "openness". They don't care. They want a phone that works, that provides a consistent and conherent experience, and that meets their needs. iOS provides this, and Android has the potential to provide this. Believing that "openness" has something to do with it is the reason why linux still languishes in the backwater of the desktop. Linux proponents fail to realise that the majority of users do not care about "openness". They want email, web browsing, and World of Warcraft without having to jump though a lot of technical hoops to get them.

If Android is to be truly open, this is what Google must do:

* Exert control over hardware specs, so there is not so much fragmentation. This vastly improves the environment for developers.
* Exert control over the mobile OS upgrade path. They need to cut carriers out of this, and deliver updates and upgrades directly to the user, the way Apple currently does.
* Produce and enforce a clear set of "user experience" standards, the way Apple does. This ensures that users get a consistent experience from apps. One of my main announaces with the Cydia store apps is that a lot of them do not adhere to any rational user experience guidelines.
* Kill off "exclusive deals" with carriers that allow Android phones to be cluttered with junk apps that cannot be removed. This would need to go into the licencing of the OS to pull hardware vendors into line.
* Design and release a "clean" Android image that can be installed on any phone meeting the hardware specs.
* Develop an open and clear roadmap. Currently, Google does not communicate it's current development roadmap to anyone outside the company. This is not the action of a company promoting "open" software. You see open development planning with linux, and you should see this with Android.

Apart from those, I notice that you failed to address any of my arguments. You just spout the party line that Android is "open" (whatever that means) and Apple is "closed" (whatever that means.)
 Last edited: by johnd
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorTheMadMartian
Alien with an attitude
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Quoting johnd:
Quote:
Nope. It just an abberation of the US telecommunications industry. The fact that Apple is currently looking at a sim design that allows you to change your carrier on-the-fly demonstrates that they are not happy with what they were forced to do to enter the mobile phone field. (And, no, the idea hasn't been scuttled by the carriers. They just wish the idea would go away).

I don't know that they were 'forced' to do anything.  As I understand it, Jobs all but blackmailed Cingular (now AT&T), offering them exclusivity in exchange for loads of concessions, and made out like a bandit.  It seems that one of those concessions was that 'exclusivity' only applied to the states.  To be clear, Jobs went to Cingular, in order to get them to fund the development, and left the consumer holding the bag.  From what I have read, they offered the same deal to Verizon, and were turned down.
Quote:
Since anyone can develop apps and submit them to the store, I would hardly call it closed.

Doesn't Apple reserve the right to deny apps?  The fact that anyone can submit an app means nothing if Apple can close the door on them.  I'm not saying that the Android OS is open, I really don't know, but making everybody stand behind the velvet rope, hoping to get into the club, doesn't scream open to me, and that is exactly what Apple is doing.

As to the rest, since I don't own a phone that runs either OS, I can't comment.
No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar
 Last edited: by TheMadMartian
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
Registered: March 20, 2007
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Quoting johnd:
Quote:
You see, like so many people you have fallen for the "religious" argument that somehow phones built on Android represent some sort of "open" ideal

I don't know what you're talking about.  "My" cell phone is a Blackberry owned by my employer.  I couldn't care less about either an iPhone or an Android based phone, I just hate to see zealots pushing the fantasy of an "open" Apple on an unsuspecting public.

As TheMadMartian said so well, it's not "open" when Apple can make your app unavailable.

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