I know right? To want help in order to make the product even better for the community is just plain silly.

Quoting Alien Redrum:

Quote:
The point is the mentality is this is how it's always been, we don't know why, but it just is and it shouldn't change. That's why the analogy is so spot on.

I understand the analogy just fine, I just don't think it fits.  Clearly you think it does, but it seems to be based on a faulty premise...that premise being that we believe it shouldn't change.  That simply isn't true, at least not for me.  I do think it should change, I just know that it won't, so I don't let it bother me.

Some people are born with good customer service skills, some are not.  Some people can be taught good customer service skills, some, no matter how hard they try or how good their intentions, can't.  It's not their fault, it's just something that they can't do.  Ken, from everything I have seen over the last ten years, is one of those people who can't.

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The scorpion and the frog analogy (with Ken being the scorpion) is a good one (I didn't watch the video, as I'm familiar with the story). And, wow, I'm sorry you can accept that. I personally think it's a douche move to promise something and not fulfill on it,

No need to be sorry as, for reasons I don't care to go into here, I am actually glad that I can accept it.  While I do enjoy the occasional 'spirited discussions' that go on around here, at the end of the day, this really isn't important enough for me to get all bent out of shape over.  I am actuall baffled that my c'est la vie attitude, towards this little forum, would bother anybody that much.

Quoting TheMadMartian:

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Quoting Alien Redrum:

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The point is the mentality is this is how it's always been, we don't know why, but it just is and it shouldn't change. That's why the analogy is so spot on.

I understand the analogy just fine, I just don't think it fits.  Clearly you think it does, but it seems to be based on a faulty premise...that premise being that we believe it shouldn't change.  That simply isn't true, at least not for me.  I do think it should change, I just know that it won't, so I don't let it bother me.

Aaaah, I get you now, thank you for explaining. Now I can see where you are coming from.

Quote:
Some people are born with good customer service skills, some are not.  Some people can be taught good customer service skills, some, no matter how hard they try or how good their intentions, can't.  It's not their fault, it's just something that they can't do.  Ken, from everything I have seen over the last ten years, is one of those people who can't.

I agree with you, but that does not excuse the lack of participation from his and Gerri's side. (I realize it is something you (as well as others) have grown used to, and I'm not (as well as others and I don't want to ever be used to garbage customer service on a product I paid for. Ever.

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No need to be sorry as, for reasons I don't care to go into here, I am actually glad that I can accept it.  While I do enjoy the occasional 'spirited discussions' that go on around here, at the end of the day, this really isn't important enough for me to get all bent out of shape over.  I am actuall baffled that my c'est la vie attitude, towards this little forum, would bother anybody that much.

Speaking for myself, I see you as someone who put a ton of work into the program (via helping on the forums, submissions, whatever) and you are used to, for lack of a better word, putting up with it. It's disheartening that the people who have been here the longest have this sense of defeat when it comes to communication. It's frustrating when everyone sees it, everyone knows it, but when a thread like this is started in complaint, the people who have dealt with it the longest are against it (or, even worse, display a 'nothing will change, it's been like this all along, everything's normal and fine' attitude. Well, yeah, I guess it is normal, but that doesn't make it right, all things considered. It's pathetic, really, the way the contribution discussion forum is pretty much ignored by the people who make money off the people who are the most passionate about the software. It's disgusting.

Don't get me wrong, your c'est la vie attitude doesn't bother me in such a way I'll lose sleep, I promise you, this is the least of my worries in the bigger picture of life. 

What bothers me is it's as if a general attitude that permeates the forum is 'this is how it's always been, this is how it always will be'. That sucks. And it's lame. And there's a variety of other adjectives I can use. You guys (by you guys, I mean (most of) the people who have been here since the beginning more-or-less) completely sell yourself short on what you do for the program. Again and again I say the (local) program is awesome. Top notch. And, again and again I say it would be nothing (at least not the powerhouse that it is) without the end users. It's not too much to ask for the people making the most from the program thank the people who are putting in work for them with the participation they say they will give. To accept otherwise is what gets me.

Not to mention that they would rather lose fantastic contributors and plug-in developers than deal with the cancers that infected the forum. Don't get me wrong, I'm the first to admit that the moderation has made the forum more pleasant with the handling of problematic users and unwelcome posts, but it's sad that it got to that point to begin with. And I'll tell you this, it is my firm belief that it was the forum members who said, dammit, do something, that finally got that ball into motion. Fortunately, they did, and I'll give credit for that. So what's so wrong with saying, dammit, talk to us? Help us. One problem is more-or-less fixed (yes, things get heated, still, but there is now some sort of repercussions for actions), so let's work this next problem. Because it is a problem. Even if you are used to it, it makes it no less of a problem. If someone came to my house and offered free yardwork and had questions on how to start the mower, you better be damn sure that I'm going to come and help them start the mower.

I think that I'm frustrated some, too, because I want to be more passionate myself with submissions, but I just can't bring myself to do it anymore because the lack of caring from Ken and Gerri. I have plenty of DVDs that I know would be a benefit to submit, but, honestly, I just don't bother. What's the point. I mean, if the attitude of Ken and Gerri is 'I got your money, I'm done with you (oh, I mean I'm done with you unless I need you -- I really don't care if you need me)' why should I help make their product better for future users? Let's be honest, I'm absolutely convinced they don't care. It becomes more apparent each day that they don't care about the customer and the lack of participation in this very thread solidifies that. But I also hope that I won't ever get used to it.

I will admit that I have only skimmed this thread... it's a waste of time. I see this as much more black and white... many of you debating have been here many years... I myself have been here 8 years... the communication / moderation right now is actually at an all time high... with that said... you should know what to expect and enjoy the program (which it seems you all can agree on)...

If you are not happy with the customer service / support / program... go elsewhere... the program makes it every easy to export your data so that you can track it however you like. It amazes me that even without Skip the bickering and general poor attitude continues.

Quoting surfeur51:

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Quoting Forum Moderator:

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The Contact Us link is the best way to submit requests of those kind.  Support tickets are really for program bugs, etc.

I expect support will forward as appropriate, but for a more direct route, Contact Us is the way.

When may I expect an answer to the Contact Us request I send about december, 20?

Bump...

To facilitate the answer, it could just be one of those (just copy/paste and send)
1/ We have received your request. Though we understand the problem, we do not think it would be an improvement for dvdprofiler and we'll not change this part of the rules.
2/ Thanks for your interesting proposal. This will be introduced in the next update of the rules.
3/ We have received your request. It needs more investigation before taking any decision. We'll contact you in a few weeks.

Quoting TheMadMartian:

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I payed, right around, $20 for this software.  For that $20 I have gotten 10+ years of program upgrades and profile updates.  I don't think I have another piece of software that has given me this much bang for my buck.

Do I wish Ken would step in more often?  Sure, but, because I have gotten more than my money's worth out of this product, it doesn't really bother me.  Don't get me wrong, I do understand the frustration, that's just how I look at it.

Couldn't have said it any better. The software comes at a bargain one time fee and its updated for a decade. it has a huge community and the software itself works like a charm for me, and this all for those few bucks.
I think we should really not complain here

But yes, would be nice if Invelos would step in  abit more often here, but I am also fine as it is.

Donnie

Quoting surfeur51:

Quote:
Bump...

I consider this thread answers my Contact Us request.

It's true, Invelos = Terrible Support.

Here's some others:

Invelos = Fantastic products
Invelos = 7 letter word
Invelos = Security in the event of theft / fire
Invelos = Fun Hobby
Invelos = Lack of manpower to do everything the users want

The list goes on and on.  I wish support was better.  It isn't.  I've spent almost 10 years complaining, then giving up and watching others complain.  I've learned to accept Invelos for what it is.  Doing otherwise just leads to frustration.  If threads like these made a difference, I'd start a new one every day.

Hopefully this thread will be the one that makes a difference.  I suspect it won't.  Fortunately I've never been in a position where I couldn't enjoy the basic functionality I paid for.  Hopefully that will never happen.