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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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Mei Melancon |
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| Author |
Message |
| Registered: March 29, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 4,479 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Unicus69: Quote:
The only way that 'Mei Melançon' can be entered is if she is credited 'Mei Melançon' or 'MEI MELANÇON'. We are speaking of common name, not the way to enter credits, as in fact, there are at least two different credits. | | | | Images from movies |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 13,201 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting surfeur51: Quote:
Quoting Unicus69:
Quote:
The only way that 'Mei Melançon' can be entered is if she is credited 'Mei Melançon' or 'MEI MELANÇON'.
We are speaking of common name, not the way to enter credits, as in fact, there are at least two different credits. And the common name is determined by the most credited form. It is not determinded by IMDb nor is it decided by what you believe to be correct. This actress is not French. She was born in the Philippines and raised in Japan. Yes, her mother is of 'French heritage', but her father is Japanese and Chinese. Yes, her mother's maiden name was 'Melançon'. But that doesn't mean her name is 'Melançon'. For all you know, she dropped the cedilla from her name when she started working in Hollywood. I did look her up on google. The overwhelming majority of sites list her as 'Mei Melancon'. Absent something official from the actress herself, I am going to accept that. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 14, 2007 |  Posts: 2,366 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Ken Cole: Quote:
There was no overrule. Gerri's statement was misinterpreted to turn capitalization rules into something more than what it was meant. Quoting Gerri Cole: Quote:
Keep in mind folks, this only comes into play when the credits are all capitalized. If they are not capitalized then no changes to the credits are expected. In addition, it applies to only capitalization rules, so adding tildes and accents are not the intent here unless it is affected by the capitalization. Quoting Ken Cole: Quote:
No, there are no special English rules to apply. Since "é" has a corresponding "É", simple capital conversion is all that's required. If the character used in the all-caps name is "É", convert it to "é" as needed to create mixed case. If the character used in all-caps is "E", convert it to "e" as needed to create mixed case. I'm a bit confused here. In the statement made by Gerri I understood we could use tildes and accents even if they do not appear in the capitals, but in your statement we should never use tildes and accents unless they do appear in the capitals. | | | Martin Zuidervliet
DVD Profiler Nederlands | | | | Last edited: by Daddy DVD |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | Nothing to be at all confused about, martin. gerri did say that and Ken overruled it. SIMPLE. In short, do not make up data, if it appears ON SCREEN fine, if NOT then don't create it.
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video | | | | Last edited: by Winston Smith |
| | Registered: March 29, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 4,479 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Daddy DVD: Quote:
In the statement made by Gerri I understood ... Everybody understood the same thing as you, and that made some users whine very loudly. Then, Ken clearly overruled Gerri's statement, to please the whiners... | | | | Images from movies | | | | Last edited: by surfeur51 |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,201 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Daddy DVD: Quote:
I'm a bit confused here. In the statement made by Gerri I understood we could use tildes and accents even if they do not appear in the capitals, but in your statement we should never use tildes and accents unless they do appear in the capitals. It would seem that you understood it incorrectly...as did I...which is why Ken had to clarify the situation. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,201 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting surfeur51: Quote:
Quoting Daddy DVD:
Quote:
In the statement made by Gerri I understood ...
Everybody understood the same thing as you, and that made some users whine very loudly. Then, Ken clearly overruled Gerri's statement, to please the whiners... No, everybody didn't understand it the same way...I am fairly sure of at least one person who didn't. And to claim that Ken overruled Gerri...which is calling him a liar because he already stated that he did nothing of the sort...to please the 'whiners' is completely without merit. He claims he made his clarification because 'we' misunderstood what Gerri had said. I see no reason not to believe him. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Posts: 2,366 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Unicus69: Quote:
It would seem that you understood it incorrectly...as did I...which is why Ken had to clarify the situation. I don't understand why everyone could have understood it differently besides Ken. Quoting Unicus69: Quote:
He claims he made his clarification because 'we' misunderstood what Gerri had said. The only problem in my view is that his clarification contradicts that of Gerri and therefore it could be seen as an overrule. | | | Martin Zuidervliet
DVD Profiler Nederlands | | | | Last edited: by Daddy DVD |
| | Registered: March 14, 2007 |  Posts: 630 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Daddy DVD: Quote:
Quoting Unicus69:
Quote:
He claims he made his clarification because 'we' misunderstood what Gerri had said.
The only problem in my view is that his clarification contradicts that of Gerri and therefore it could be seen as an overrule. It contradicts what appears to be the way the majority of us understood Gerri - which does not necessarely mean it contradicts what Gerri intended to say. I have no idea why the rules aren't simply updated. As far as I can see the current status is pretty simple: If the credits are written all uppercase or all lowercase (yes, I ignore if a name is written "McWHATEVER" for this discussion): Use capitialization rules standard to the language of the cast/crew member's name or nationality to determine which characters should be converted to upper/lower caseUse English rules to perform the actual conversion.Unfortunately some people insist we call the convertion done according to the way most English speakers would do it "neutral". I have no idea why - they are not neutral, and the term neutral just adds confusion. | | | Regards
Lars |
| | Registered: March 29, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 4,479 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Unicus69: Quote:
No, everybody didn't understand it the same way... Even after this clarification ?: Quoting Gerri Cole: Quote:
You should not give out a NO vote if it does not follow the nationality rules unless it is undoing where someone has already corrected it. If you dont know any better, then do what you know. If people want to vote No to that, I would expect a detailed explanation why and a subsequent contribution to make the correct changes.
Some people are interpretting it a little too literally. My clarification was to allow people the freedom to use the nationality rules if they know them. If they don't, just making capital letters small is still perfectly acceptable.
-Gerri | | | | Images from movies | | | | Last edited: by surfeur51 |
| | Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Posts: 2,366 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting lmoelleb: Quote:
Unfortunately some people insist we call the convertion done according to the way most English speakers would do it "neutral". I have no idea why - they are not neutral, and the term neutral just adds confusion. I can think of a reason and that's lack of respect for other peoples' cultural differences. | | | Martin Zuidervliet
DVD Profiler Nederlands |
| | Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Posts: 2,366 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Gerri Cole: Quote:
Some people are interpretting it a little too literally. My clarification was to allow people the freedom to use the nationality rules if they know them. If they don't, just making capital letters small is still perfectly acceptable. Quoting Ken Cole: Quote:
Quoting lmoelleb:
Quote:
2) Use English rules to do the actual conversion between lower and upper case (so always convert "E" to "e", never to "é").
No, there are no special English rules to apply. Wait, maybe now I understand. If you know the nationality rules you could do what Gerri said and if you don't you could do what Ken said. | | | Martin Zuidervliet
DVD Profiler Nederlands | | | | Last edited: by Daddy DVD |
| | Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Posts: 3,830 |
| | Posted: | | | | She's an American actress and former fashion model, Not French | | | | Sources for one or more of the changes and/or additions were not submitted. Please include the sources for your changes in the contribution notes, especially for cast and crew additions. | | | | Last edited: by ? |
| | Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Posts: 630 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Daddy DVD: Quote:
Quoting lmoelleb:
Quote:
Unfortunately some people insist we call the convertion done according to the way most English speakers would do it "neutral". I have no idea why - they are not neutral, and the term neutral just adds confusion.
I can think of a reason and that's lack of respect for other peoples' cultural differences. If I have to guess I think it is just because they don't know better. I would probably have made the same mistake if it wasn't for my professionel experience in software localization. | | | Regards
Lars |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Daddy DVD: Quote:
Quoting lmoelleb:
Quote:
Unfortunately some people insist we call the convertion done according to the way most English speakers would do it "neutral". I have no idea why - they are not neutral, and the term neutral just adds confusion.
I can think of a reason and that's lack of respect for other peoples' cultural differences. Martin: One more time our Rules are not constructed around CULTURE, they are constructed around real data which is presented ON SCREEN, they are called CREDITS. Other databases allow you to invent non-existent data, names, roles whatever data you want to invent....we don't. It also has nothing to do with Lars' claim, it has to do with a total failure to comprehend the standard which was applied. I have said this numerous times and it remains as true today as it has always been the Rules were designed to reflect NO culture other than the data which is displayed ON SCREEN. If data is not there, you cannot hallucinate it to be there, it either is or it is NOT. Myonly regret is that since we don't support Unicode yet, we are trapped having to fudge some data which appears On Screen but we can't make appear in the Program, but that is something that we have no control over, we can only hope that one day this will be fixed. But as, I said this is a complete refusal to understand the standard that was applied and why, and to attempt to use inflammatory comments such as "they don't know better", which speaking for this uuser I find insulting and offensive beyond belief. This user is not an idiot, but if you really want to make such imlication, the idiots are those who refuse to comprehend the whys , wherefores and claim some sort BS cultural insensitivity. Argue with the people who put the data On Screen, maybe you can get them to change their ways. Good luck, jim and if you are caught or killed the Secretary will not disavow any knowledge of your actions. Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,201 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Daddy DVD: Quote:
Quoting Ken Cole:
Quote:
No, there are no special English rules to apply.
Wait, maybe now I understand. If you know the nationality rules you could do what Gerri said and if you don't you could do what Ken said. Wrong. If you would use the entire quote, you will see that Ken was very specific. Quoting Ken Cole: Quote:
No, there are no special English rules to apply. Since "é" has a corresponding "É", simple capital conversion is all that's required. If the character used in the all-caps name is "É", convert it to "é" as needed to create mixed case. If the character used in all-caps is "E", convert it to "e" as needed to create mixed case. We do not add accents, or cedillas, or anything else. Whether Ken overruled Gerri, or we just misunderstood...what does it matter? Ken gave us the final word and that is all that should matter. This all reminds me of a child trying to pit his mom against his dad in order to get his way.  | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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