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Dancing with Wolves
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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorKathy
Registered: May 29, 2007
Reputation: Highest Rating
United States Posts: 3,475
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I think that it might be the words "Effects Supervisor" that makes these people seem to be legitimate Crew members.

It is when there is additional information, such as the word "Buffalo", that causes much of the disagreements among the community.

Does the Crew chart need to be followed to the letter or not?

If Ken has determined that the Crew chart must be matched exactly that is one thing.

But, if Ken has determined that "functional equivalents" or "variations" of data is acceptable then the above question is moot.

What the community needs to do then is to carefully research any data that does not exactly match the Crew chart in order to satisfy any questions regarding this information.
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorTheMadMartian
Alien with an attitude
Registered: March 13, 2007
Reputation: Highest Rating
United States Posts: 13,201
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Quoting Grendell:
Quote:
Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
The only thing I took issue with, and it is the only thing I ever take issue with, is when a user believes that his interpretation is the only valid one and chooses to insult anyone who doesn't agree with them.


The only one I see insulting anyone is you. You seem to be turning into the new Skip. Very sad to see.

So, calling someone's post 'nonsense' isn't being insulting? 
No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorTheMadMartian
Alien with an attitude
Registered: March 13, 2007
Reputation: Highest Rating
United States Posts: 13,201
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Quoting Kathy:
Quote:
I think that it might be the words "Effects Supervisor" that makes these people seem to be legitimate Crew members.

I agree, that seems to be why they were entered.  The reason I don't think they are allowed is because 'Effects Supervisor' isn't in the chart.
Quote:
It is when there is additional information, such as the word "Buffalo", that causes much of the disagreements among the community.

I actually don't see a lot of disagreement among the community.  Whenever these types of credits come up, at least from what I can remember, most users seem to be on the same page.  I have only seen a few that disagree.
Quote:
Does the Crew chart need to be followed to the letter or not?

The crew chart can't be followed to the letter.  If it were, we would have to remove a lot of credts from UK and Australian profiles.

We would also need to remove any song writer credit that doesn't actually say 'Song Writer'.  I mean, "Into the West written by Fran Walsh, Howard Shore, and Annie Lennox" isn't exactly in the crew chart. 
Quote:
What the community needs to do then is to carefully research any data that does not exactly match the Crew chart in order to satisfy any questions regarding this information.

When I contribute these credits, this is exactly what I do.
No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantAlien Redrum
Proudly blocked by liars.
Registered: August 23, 2008
Reputation: High Rating
United States Posts: 1,656
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KNB created all those Buffalo you see in Dances with Wolves (in particular the dead ones). KNB is Robert Kurtzman, Greg Nicotero amd Howard Berger.

I would absolutely vote yes on Visual Effects. Especially considering the boost that movie gave to their company.
Reviewer, HorrorTalk.com

"I also refuse to document CLT results and I pay my bills to avoid going to court." - Sam, keeping it real, yo.
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorTheMadMartian
Alien with an attitude
Registered: March 13, 2007
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United States Posts: 13,201
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Quoting Alien Redrum:
Quote:
KNB created all those Buffalo you see in Dances with Wolves (in particular the dead ones). KNB is Robert Kurtzman, Greg Nicotero amd Howard Berger.

I would absolutely vote yes on Visual Effects. Especially considering the boost that movie gave to their company.

From what I have read, they did, indeed, create the animatronic buffalo.  That being the case, this is a creature effect, but we don't credit the 'Creature Effect Supervisor', only the 'Creature Designer'. 
No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantAlien Redrum
Proudly blocked by liars.
Registered: August 23, 2008
Reputation: High Rating
United States Posts: 1,656
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Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
Quoting Alien Redrum:
Quote:
KNB created all those Buffalo you see in Dances with Wolves (in particular the dead ones). KNB is Robert Kurtzman, Greg Nicotero amd Howard Berger.

I would absolutely vote yes on Visual Effects. Especially considering the boost that movie gave to their company.

From what I have read, they did, indeed, create the animatronic buffalo.  That being the case, this is a creature effect, but we don't credit the 'Creature Effect Supervisor', only the 'Creature Designer'. 


I would definitely not vote no if it were submitted under Creature Effects, especially considering they made 20+ buffalo for the film.

(Note, if that seems snide to you, not intended. I know where you are coming from.)
Reviewer, HorrorTalk.com

"I also refuse to document CLT results and I pay my bills to avoid going to court." - Sam, keeping it real, yo.
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar Contributorhal9g
Who is John Galt?
Registered: March 13, 2007
Reputation: High Rating
United States Posts: 6,635
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Quoting Kathy:
Quote:
Does the Crew chart need to be followed to the letter or not?


Based on my interpretation of this verbiage in the Rules, I do not believe that the on line db allows any credit that is not listed exactly as in the crew table:

Quoting the Rules:
Quote:
For each category, include only those people credited with the roles listed in the "Role" and "Credited As" columns. If someone is not credited with one of these roles (or direct translations of these roles), do not include them in the Crew section.


The use of the term "or direct translations of these roles", IMHO, means translations into the language of the locality of the profile, and not the current interpretation by many to mean subjectively deciding if the credit is a "functional equivalent" of a role listed in the table.
We have seriously diluted the value of the data by allowing these interpretations where a "Buffalo Effects Supervisor" is given the same credit in DVDP as a "Special Effects Supervisor" who is responsible for the the special effects of the entire film. 
Hal
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorTheMadMartian
Alien with an attitude
Registered: March 13, 2007
Reputation: Highest Rating
United States Posts: 13,201
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Quoting Alien Redrum:
Quote:
I would definitely not vote no if it were submitted under Creature Effects, especially considering they made 20+ buffalo for the film.

I understand where you are comming from.  The rules make us list all the digital, visual and special effects people under a singe credit, yet, for whatever reason, leave out the same people when it comes to creature effects.  Doesn't seem quite right to me either.
Quote:
(Note, if that seems snide to you, not intended. I know where you are coming from.)

Didn't seem snide at all, so, no worries.
No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar
 Last edited: by TheMadMartian
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