Quoting mediadogg:

Quote:
Man this is hard work. But a labor of love!

Still swinging between Denon and Onkyo. Very similar awesome features.

Main considerations at this point:

Denon - best asthetics in overall layout (obviously totally subjective), but no discrete 7.2 input
Onkyo - has everything - I just like the looks of the Denon better

I need to study details of upconversion - they are probably the same, and which of them has HDMI passthru when the unit is off - convenient when we just want to watch the LCD without fanfare.

Edit: Ok, decision is pencilled in: Onkyo TX-1008. Very slight edge on features over Denon AVR-3311C, better internal layout (from pictures anyway), 12 lbs heavier - I figure that means more conservatively rated transformers or larger heat sinks. Thanks to all for all the good ideas and info!  I found both models for just under $1000.

Congratulations on your preliminary decision!

HDMI passthru: I know for a fact that all Denons have it. Don't know about the Onkyo, but to be honest I cannot imagine a middle-class receiver from a top-notch brand like Onkyo not having it.

With regard to upconversion: decisive for the performance in this area is the on-board video processor.
The Denon uses the Anchor Bay ABT-2015. The Onkyo uses the Faroudja DCDi Cinema. I can't tell you which of these two is better - perhaps some research on the web could help you. Or just go and ask the guys over at AV Science Forum; I'm sure someone there can help you.

Finally I would strongly recommend that before making your decision final you go out, find yourself a good HiFi store and listen to both receivers, preferably in combination with the speakers you intend to use. Different brands have a different timbre in the sound they give out (which of course has different effects on different speakers, which is why the specific combination with speakers is important as well). In the end, I would say that whether you like the receiver's timbre or not is more important than a slight difference in features.

Good luck!

At the upper end of the sub 1000, have you considered the Marantz 6005? Or even the 5005?

I have the 6004, and fully love it.....

I am a firm believer in Marantz Receivers

Charlie

Quoting dee1959jay:

Quote:
@mediadogg:
The well-reputed German website areadvd.de has tested both machines and labeled them both as "reference-class". I don't know if you can read German, but I'll translate their essential findings for you:

Many thanks. I don't read German well enough to have done that. I feel my head says "Denon," but my heart says "Onkyo." (Or is it the other way around?  )

Actually, they are both so fine and so far above what I have, that I will not go wrong on either one. It will come down to some frilly items, or maybe a good deal that catches my attention. But for now, I am still leaning towards the Onkyo because of a couple of features: 1 more HDMI input, and discrete 5.1 input - neither of which I have any need for right now (   ).

One thing though would probably sway the decision - but I can't get the info - which of them supports switching of the HDMI inputs when the AMP is "off."

(Edit: The translations were cool. Pictures even better. I see both models have a "Standby", which of course is a way to get some functions such as switching without running the amplifiers. The Onkyo even has a Button labelled "HDMI Thru", but I'm sure the Denon will also do it in standby mode - what else could that mean?) Damn, maybe I just need to get them both. Maybe sell my car .... 

I now saw that the German Onkyo test contains a section on comparisons with the competition. Here's my translation of what they've got to say on the Denon vs. the Onkyo:

"Denon AVR-3311: a very tough competitor for the TX-NR1008. In terms of sound, the Denon feels committed to harmony, without giving up presence and dynamics. It delivers an equally good level of tone stability - but just seven instead of nine final stages (power amps). Overall the Onkyo and the Denon are performing at practically equivalent levels - however the excellent video section of the AVR-3311 gives it a head start, as its performance is the best available in this class. The Onkyo counters with even more connectivity. In turn, the Denon counters with its added ability to stream JPEG images. On the whole it's a tie - at present nothing in this class beats the TX-NR1008 and AVR-3311."

Conclusion: whichever of the two you choose, you can't go wrong!

       

Well, I thought that since you're always being extremely helpful to fellow users with migration, plug-in issues etc. it was about time to return the favour! 

BTW on-line bargains for the US market can be found here.

Quoting mediadogg:

Quote:
1 more HDMI input, and discrete 5.1 input

You'll need it eventually if you're a gamer or have kids who are gamers.

Congratulations and enjoy! 

Ok, I did it. Ordered the Onkyo TX-1008 on Thursday. It showed up on Saturday (Prime membership). Spent all day hooking up and calibrating - and I am still nowhere near done taking advantage of all the bells and whistles, gizmos and settings!

Initial Reaction: gasp ...

This is one of the most awesome upgrades I have made to my system since I got my speakers. I am absolutely delighted that with the combination of a good research info ( ) and Amazon, I got an amazing value for the money. I was expecting an improvement, but I did not realize how much better both my video and audio would be. My HDMI outputs to both LCD and Projector are tack crisp (even when simultaneous). The colors literally jump off the screen.

My audio is simply glorious. Brilliant highs, open "airy" sound: throaty lows, not a hint of distortion at super loud levels. I'm re-listening to all of my favorite CDs - Jazz, Classical (Organ right now - yum!) and Pop. There are a bizillion listening contour settings, but all easy to access and they stay stuck for each input. And you can also configure a profile with affinity to a specific input.

Here are other surprises:

- I can set the output speaker impedance to better compensate for the long wire lengths I've got
- The Standby mode preserves not only the HDMI selections, but it will also output the upconverted Component inputs with analog audio to my TV. This was important to me becuase my old Xbox 360 has neither HDMI nor digital audio out. Even so, the results are fantastic.
- PC / VGA input (finally) looks as good as HDMI. Simplifies my PC setup.
- Each input can be level compensated to equalize audio level inbalances
- Also, each video input can have individual video compensation applied (haven't tried this yet)
- The LFE output does not load down my TV's subwoofer's LFE input, so now I actually have 3 subwoofers: two up front strung off the front speakers, and one in the back of the room, shared with the TV. The TV uses the speaker terminals, and the receiver uses the LFE port, with no apparent adverse interaction. My old receiver used to load down the LFE port so badly that the TV bass suffered.
- Most inputs can be renamed, and /or re-assigned. So far, I have been able to connect everything, with inputs left over, without having to rename. For example, I have two cable boxes: one connected to SAT/Cbl and the other connected to TV. The second STB is for my home-grown DVR using the Hauppage component video recorder and my HTPC.

There is only one cable going to my TV, but it can see everything - regardless of whether the receiver is on or in standby. So, we just get up in the morning and click on the TV as usual. Bonus, the remote was either pre-configured for or detected my FIOS STB.

So far, I have retired about two dozen a/v cables of various sorts, a 4-port component a/v switcher and a 4-port Oppo HDMI switch: yet I have more connection versatility than I had before, and some still left over. Man!!!

Today, I'm going to re-run the auto-setup with all furniture and drapes in movie mode, and setup the IP adresses, music streaming and internet radio.

I'll give more news as this puppy continues to romp in this new and exciting field.

Thanks once again to all who helped me with this important and, so far, most gratifying decision.