Quoting VibroCount:

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Quoting TheDarkKnight:

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Quoting FilmAlba:

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John Wayne just sucked period.

You just can't have a conversation/discussion without threadcrapping, can you?

I disliked Wayne's politics (John Birch Society member) as much as anyone. But his acting skills were evident to anyone.

After years of film school, I realized that there are a broad spectrum of acting styles. There are character actors, whom audiences see not as the actor, but as the character only. There are stars, who act like themselves in every role they take. Some can move back and forth, some become so well known that their performances are tainted with their personas even when lost in a character. Some say their lines and hit their marks; some are always way over the top in a "make sure the second balcony sees your performance" sort of way.

Anyone who ever watched John Wayne in "She Wore a Yellow Ribbon" -- you know the scene (and if you do not, never, ever discuss Wayne's ability to act), early on in the movie, when Wayne's character, a far older than Wayne, officer is retiring from the cavalry, and in order to read an inscrption on the watch his troops are giving to him, he looks around to see if anyone is watching (everyone is) and he takes out of his tunic a tiny pair of spectacles, puts them on, and struggles to read the words. This is not Wayne: this is his character, totally believable, and as Oscar winning a performance as any actor has ever performed. To watch that, and his performances in dozens of other great films, and then to declare he sucks is trolling of the highest magnitude.

You seem to know nothing of film before the 1970s. Learn something, then your opinion might mean something beyond trolling incoherently. There was a century of filmmaking before the 1980s, not just a decade.

Why do I respond to you?

Ok we will forget that films surprise surprise about stopping those evil nasty Indians but not with one whole army no with one patrol oh god bless wonderful American bravery and how our great country was made according to John Ford and John Wayne.

I like films pre 1970's but not as many as the decade and decades after that why? Because Hollywood finally matured realising that innovation was the way forward and not being stuck in the same nonsense that John Wayne was in.

What you seem to fail to understand is that film-making is a reflection of the societal norms of the time.  Movies made in the 40's and 50's reflect the mores of the 40's and 50's when the world was fighting a world war and/or recovering from the same.  In the 20's they were carefree and wild, just like the lives of the people who went to see them.

Like any art form, movies have gone through an evolution over the past 120+ years.  Technologies have changed.  Belief systems have changed, and unlike you, I don't believe always for the better.  What social redeeming value do movies like SAW 1-6 offer the viewing public? Or films that depict nothing but foul language and gratuitous sex?

I don't need to go to the movies to see what real life is all about.  I just need to open my eyes and look around at the real thing.

I suppose you don't read literature from prior to the 1970's either.  Or worse yet, like so many of your age group, you probably read very little, period.  Why should you when you are bombarded with information 24X7?  You've got 24 hour news, the internet, twitter, facebook, etc. etc., etc.

Poor substitutes for the great classics of the world, I'm afraid.

It saddens me that you have chosen to ignore some of the greatest movies ever made, just because they pre-date your existence.  It is said that those who chose to ignore history are destined to relive it.  The same can be said for those who are totally unaware of history by their own choices.

Quoting hal9g:

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What social redeeming value do movies like SAW 1-6 offer the viewing public? Or films that depict nothing but foul language and gratuitous sex?

Not to mention, what kind of entertainment value do such things hold?  The movies being made tell you a whole lot about the people watching them, and most of it's not very good these days.

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Quoting hal9g:

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What you seem to fail to understand is that film-making is a reflection of the societal norms of the time.  Movies made in the 40's and 50's reflect the mores of the 40's and 50's when the world was fighting a world war and/or recovering from the same.  In the 20's they were carefree and wild, just like the lives of the people who went to see them.

Like any art form, movies have gone through an evolution over the past 120+ years.  Technologies have changed.  Belief systems have changed, and unlike you, I don't believe always for the better.  What social redeeming value do movies like SAW 1-6 offer the viewing public? Or films that depict nothing but foul language and gratuitous sex?

I don't need to go to the movies to see what real life is all about.  I just need to open my eyes and look around at the real thing.

I suppose you don't read literature from prior to the 1970's either.  Or worse yet, like so many of your age group, you probably read very little, period.  Why should you when you are bombarded with information 24X7?  You've got 24 hour news, the internet, twitter, facebook, etc. etc., etc.

Poor substitutes for the great classics of the world, I'm afraid.

It saddens me that you have chosen to ignore some of the greatest movies ever made, just because they pre-date your existence.  It is said that those who chose to ignore history are destined to relive it.  The same can be said for those who are totally unaware of history by their own choices.

Well literature is hardly a good comparison cause it hasn't ever really been subjected to any censorship or authority since the 18th century. You hardly had someone bursting into George Orwell's flat saying you can write that. Film before the 70's was highly regulated and you would have many ppl in your face telling you what you can and can't do.

There are some great films from the pre 70's but most of the best films ever made where in that decade and beyond. You might not like films like Saw but that's freedom of choice in a diverse range of films to cater all tastes why? Because ppl like like Coppola and Leone fought a dying industry which it was because it was so highly regulated into accepting innovation as the way forward.

Quoting scotthm:

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Quoting FilmAlba:

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Film before the 70's was highly regulated and you would have many ppl in your face telling you what you can and can't do.

Why does it offend people when the Producer gets the final say on what's in a film, but not when the director gets to make that decision?  Believe it or not, producers are a legitimate part of the filmmaking process too.

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So i suppose if you think producers are so important and in that respect right you don't agree with Coppolas Godfather then.

As for sex what about films like Ang Lees The Ice Storm beautiful film about sexual jealousy

Quoting scotthm:

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Quoting FilmAlba:

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So i suppose if you think producers are so important and in that respect right you don't agree with Coppolas Godfather then.

I've never had the pleasure.

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As for sex what about films like Ang Lees The Ice Storm beautiful film about sexual jealousy

Likewise.

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You never seen The Godfather 

Quoting scotthm:

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Quoting FilmAlba:

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You never seen The Godfather 

No.  It doesn't sound as if it would appeal to me.

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Same reason I've never seen it either.

Quoting hal9g:

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What you seem to fail to understand is that film-making is a reflection of the societal norms of the time.  Movies made in the 40's and 50's reflect the mores of the 40's and 50's when the world was fighting a world war and/or recovering from the same.  In the 20's they were carefree and wild, just like the lives of the people who went to see them.

Like any art form, movies have gone through an evolution over the past 120+ years.  Technologies have changed.  Belief systems have changed, and unlike you, I don't believe always for the better.  What social redeeming value do movies like SAW 1-6 offer the viewing public? Or films that depict nothing but foul language and gratuitous sex?

I don't need to go to the movies to see what real life is all about.  I just need to open my eyes and look around at the real thing.

I suppose you don't read literature from prior to the 1970's either.  Or worse yet, like so many of your age group, you probably read very little, period.  Why should you when you are bombarded with information 24X7?  You've got 24 hour news, the internet, twitter, facebook, etc. etc., etc.

Poor substitutes for the great classics of the world, I'm afraid.

It saddens me that you have chosen to ignore some of the greatest movies ever made, just because they pre-date your existence.  It is said that those who chose to ignore history are destined to relive it.  The same can be said for those who are totally unaware of history by their own choices.

Well,

I do not know why you make assumptions that I ignore films prior to my bday and why you make assumptions that I do not read books.

I watched a fair share of those so called classics from Billy Wilder, I watched Citizen Cane, Casablanca, some Hitchcock films, Nosferatu, Metropolis, just to name some.
But they simply do not do it for me. You are right the films are a reflection about the times they were made in, but those are not my times.
I grew up with the punk movement in Europe, as a rebellious teenager who gave a f*** about existing morals, I wanted things to change, to be alive, to be politically incorrect, everyone should be able to say what he wants and to do what he wants.

You were also wrong about your other assumptions, I never even visited Twitter or Facebook and do not plan to do so, I do not like those social networks. I am a child of IRC and the Newsgroups , which I both use on a daily basis.

And I also read books, I love Marion Zimmer Bradley, Tokien, Bret Easton Ellis, Salinger and many more.

You are right I have no problem with films like the SAW series, they are amazing entertainment, of course they hold no deeper value, but I do not feel ashamed to watch films for entertainment too

And I have also no problem with nudity , explicit sex or violence on tv or in movies, this is part of life and why shouldn't it be part of the movies too then ?
In germany it is common to see nudity even in the afternoon hours on regular tv, we have no problems with that here, I know in America you only get to see that on cable.

Same with foul language, no one cares about that here.

I do not want to offend you in any way, but I felt I had to make some things clear, cuz your assumptions about me were pretty wrong

cheers
Donnie