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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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 Why people don't contribute reason #3,761 (Locked) |
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| Author |
Message |
| Registered: July 28, 2008 |  Posts: 42 |
| | Posted: | | | | guess I will end my mini -rant with the observation that I tried to correct a bit of data that was, and still is, clearly wrong. When I get TPB season 4 I just might copy the links above and hit the contribute button, but it really should not be this hard when the DB is so in error. I mean its not like there is a debate about the data.
of course it is also like the headshot db thing - BTW awsome job everyone - I think shots from actors prime would be better than a bunch of geratric head shots. Different point of view. I am free to change them and I do have a nice shot of a youthful Pam Grier, although she has held up nicely so probably not the best example | | | | Last edited: by Kobeck |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  | | Posts: 13,201 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Kobeck: Quote:
guess I will end my mini -rant with the observation that I tried to correct a bit of data that was, and still is, clearly wrong. When I get TPB season 4 I just might copy the links above and hit the contribute button, but it really should not be this hard when the DB is so in error. I mean its not like there is a debate about the data. It is not hard at all. In fact, it is quite easy. As I said, all you had to do was include the documentation in your contribution notes. It probably would have taken far less time than your 'mini-rant' did.  | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 29, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 4,479 |
| | | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
Quoting Kobeck:
Quote:
guess I will end my mini -rant with the observation that I tried to correct a bit of data that was, and still is, clearly wrong. When I get TPB season 4 I just might copy the links above and hit the contribute button, but it really should not be this hard when the DB is so in error. I mean its not like there is a debate about the data.
It is not hard at all. In fact, it is quite easy. As I said, all you had to do was include the documentation in your contribution notes. It probably would have taken far less time than your 'mini-rant' did. Agreed. It really is no harder than you want to make it. The process is very simple in reality. What you KNOW to be in error, may not be so obvious to everyone, especially the poor screeners. You really think they have access to 400,000+ titles in their hands. You really expect people to just accept something because you say it is so...with no supporting documentation. The Martian and myself have both been doing this for near 10 years now and neither of us would even drean of expecting someone to accept what we say just on the basis of our say so. Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  | | Posts: 5,635 |
| | Posted: | | | | I hate to agree with Skip (no, I don't), but you can convince us of nearly anything if your documentation holds up. I watched Skip and other "show me the data" hardliners agree to alter their contributions when reasonable documentation was presented to them to rethink their assumptions. A good screencap (which is a capture of a single frame from the DVD -- easy to do in many DVD playing softwares) of the uncredited performer can be very effective. If the performer is less well known than the Thriller-performing Michael Jackson, you might include another photo of the performer in question.
There are many sources for good documentation. Using one only (especially the reviled IMDB) is not adequate. Yet IMDB is a good source if it is combined with a few other sources who use other databanks than IMDB's -- like an actor's website, the All Movie Guide (again, alone, it is not enough), and other well made fansites. I found a couple UK peerage sites which helped document the surname of Helena Bonham Carter and its appropriate parsing. Sources beyond typical film databases can be quite helpful. | | | If it wasn't for bad taste, I wouldn't have no taste at all.
Cliff |
| | Registered: May 26, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 2,878 |
| | Posted: | | | | Another point that Gerri has said in previous threads about BYs and differentiating between actors is that you have to mention some films that the two actors were in.
I reasonably recently got the BYs accepted for the two actors called Bart the Bear. But in my contribution notes I included not only the documentation for the BYs, but also that Bart the Bear (1977) who appeared in The Clan of the Cave Bear and Legends of the Fall is different from Bart the Bear (2000) who appeared in Into the Wild.
I am certain I remember Gerri stating previously that just stating that there are multiple actors of the same name is not enough; that it is nearly essential to mention films that each actor appeared in to differentiate them from each other. | | | If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world.
-- Thorin Oakenshield |
| | Registered: May 19, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 5,917 |
| | Posted: | | | | So YOU were the one who caused all the amusement in the v4 database thread when I put up the By validation poll on Bart the Bear.  |
| | Registered: May 8, 2007 | | Posts: 823 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
If you looked it up, provide the links to that information in your notes. The problem with this is 9 times out of 10 "no" votes will be cast with "links mean nothing" or "links are invalid" and that's that. You can't imagine that people will continue to try to contribute after experiencing this. | | | | 99.9% of all cat plans consist only of "Step 1." |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,201 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Grendell: Quote:
Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
If you looked it up, provide the links to that information in your notes.
The problem with this is 9 times out of 10 "no" votes will be cast with "links mean nothing" or "links are invalid" and that's that. You can't imagine that people will continue to try to contribute after experiencing this. Birth Year documentation is all about links. The BY thread is full of links. Because of that, I have a hard time believing that anybody would get those kinds of votes on a BY submission...unless, of course, the links are invalid. Note, I am not saying it doesn't happen as there is no way for me to know, but it wouldn't make any sense.  | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar | | | | Last edited: by TheMadMartian |
| | Registered: March 29, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 4,479 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Grendell: Quote:
You can't imagine that people will continue to try to contribute after experiencing this. This is why I spoke of tyrannic system. When we look at contribution statistics, we have people who work and contribute data, and people who prefer to send votes to the face of workers, nit picking on details to give them more importance, than speak of dvdprofiler spirit. | | | | Images from movies |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,201 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting surfeur51: Quote:
Quoting Grendell:
Quote:
You can't imagine that people will continue to try to contribute after experiencing this.
This is why I spoke of tyrannic system. When we look at contribution statistics, we have people who work and contribute data, and people who prefer to send votes to the face of workers, nit picking on details to give them more importance, than speak of dvdprofiler spirit. You make an awful lot of assumptions as you have no idea what kind of votes I, or anybody who doesn't vote on your contributions, casts or why they cast them. Your assumption, that people do it to make them feel important, is ridiculous on it's face. Especially when you consider that the same could be said about your condescending posts.  As to the 'spirit' comment, I was being facetious. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 29, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 4,479 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
You make an awful lot of assumptions ... I just read on this forum dozen of posts of contributors complaining about no votes on their correct (per life) data, and a bunch of voters explaining that (their interpretation of) rules ask for things like Jean/Claude/Forest or "Once Upon a Time in the West" as an original title, or asking for encyclopedias of documentation, even when there is no doubt, as in this thread's case. As to the 'give importance' comment, I was being facetious. | | | | Images from movies | | | | Last edited: by surfeur51 |
| | Registered: March 15, 2007 |  Posts: 1,982 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting surfeur51: Quote:
This is why I spoke of tyrannic system.
Yves once again you go to the extreme. Since I've restarted to contribute in january after a year break, I haven't received a single no vote. Seriously it isn't that hard to give a link to prove a name is an alias or to forget our accent to please the english crowd (using é or è or ê or e isn't really the end of the world as we know it). But we never know I contribute again because the little thing that annoyed me isn't obligatory anymore, so maybe your irritant will disapear also... |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,201 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting surfeur51: Quote:
Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
You make an awful lot of assumptions ...
I just read on this forum dozen of posts of contributors complaining about no votes on their correct (per life) data, and a bunch of voters explaining that (their interpretation of) rules ask for things like Jean/Claude/Forest or "Once Upon a Time in the West" as an original title, or asking for encyclopedias of documentation, even when there is no doubt, as in this thread's case. If you are going to quote me, please quote the whole thing so that context is kept intact. I was talking about the assumptions you made about how and why people vote. Beyond that, I read those posts as well. I am not sure what those people expected as it is quite clear that, if they want to contribute, they have to follow the rules. If the can't, or won't, then they have to expect their contributions will be declined. I, and a few others, offered some advice. If the user decided to follow it, great. If not, nothing I can do. In addition, nobody is asking for encyclopedias of documentation, just some documentation. Per Gerri, all birth year submissions must be documented. I am sorry if that offends your senisibilities, but the screeners need that information to make an informed decision. If you, the general you, can't provide that documentation, then the profile should be declined. Quote:
As to the 'give importance' comment, I was being facetious. I might believe that if you hadn't made similar comments in the past. I took exception when you made the comment I quoted, so my use of it shouldn't have been taken seriously. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 29, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 4,479 |
| | Posted: | | | | I want to be clear about what I think. All what I want is to work for the best database, useful for all users. That is also the goal of everyone here, I have no doubt about that.
I disagree with some other opinions, since everybody do not see things in the same manner. I personnaly find two types of places in those forums. Some friendly places where we share headshots, layouts, translation files, technical tips, images or alternate covers, and an ugly place, full of hateful comments and bitter discussions, the contribution forum. I consider voting system, associated with poor designed rules, as the main cause of this reality. The result is some contributors leaving contribution, or making (as I do), only partial contributions, leaving in their local everything controversial to avoid no votes, which means in fact poor contributions in volume. I do not think this is the best for ALL users. Most will be happy with a complete profile even if one typo has not been reproduced exactly as on cover, but this profile no more exists, at least in zone/countries with few contributors. US contributors have no idea of the state of the database in some places and the wish of "per the rule" perfectionism goes against general interest.
And to go a little further to explain my position : I never got no votes on my change contributions (though I mainly contribute new profiles), and will do all I can to avoid such a branding. On the other hand, I avoid as much as possible to inflict that to contributors who worked to help others, and I gave only two or three no votes on extremely erroneous contributions. I also quite never vote yes, as most contributions contain at least one small error, and a yes vote would be against those stupid rules. | | | | Images from movies | | | | Last edited: by surfeur51 |
| | Registered: May 26, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 2,878 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Dr. Killpatient: Quote:
So YOU were the one who caused all the amusement in the v4 database thread when I put up the By validation poll on Bart the Bear. Actually I saw them in the BY validation thread and looked them up. After I saw that there were two Barts, I then did the submissions to get them accepted since I had films with both Barts. So actually the headshot thread made me do it. | | | If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world.
-- Thorin Oakenshield |
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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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