Quoting Blair:

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Despite what some people wish for the cost to mean, again and again (even in this topic) the "only $20" issue has been made irrelevant.

It's not about the cost. It's about principle of not living up to your own words. The only thing initially being asked in this topic is plain and simple: do what you say or take those words down. Nothing more.

Quoting Winston Smith:

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I have seen this sort of behavior lots of times when people get something for free or spend very little, they never can get enough. I understand what those who like to whine and moan are saying and what their issue is supposedly. The program is 10 years old and this is pretty much the way it has been from Day ONE, so again I ask the simple of those who carp....If you believe it is that awful a situation then why not go use something else. Your complaibning and whining is non-productive, comes across as merely "I want it MY WAY" and is frankly insulting to others of have used the program from the beginning

Please don't play the victim card. If it insults you that others are not happy with the support (AGAIN, NO-ONE IN THIS THREAD IS UNHAPPY WITH THE PROGRAM, IT IS AWESOME), then I would like to insult you repeatedly. Again, I LOVE THE PROGRAM but the forum support THAT WAS PROMISED ON PURCHASE is severely lacking.

The reason I won't go someone else, is because the program is the best on the market (IMO), with the most helpful forum members and contributors (IMO) who do the best they can on limited support from those who can settle differences on opinion on how rules should be followed in certain circumstances. That (or the cost) is NOT an issue and not even a relevant part of the argument.

Your argument does not apply here Skip.

Just because Ken has always been like this doesn't mean we can't voice our issues with it.

Big greens for Blair and Kathy. Well said. 

Quoting samuelrichardscott:

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Quoting Winston Smith:

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If it is not about the money and a there is a ten year track record of exactly what some are complaining then I think it is valid to ask the question " why not go somewhere else?"

Oh yes, because I knew the track record before buying? AQnd again, the why not go somewhere else is not valid because we both agree this is the best program on the market. My problem is not with the program in any way, shape or form. I have said that many times in this thread.

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Things are not likely to change, some of us truly believe that Profiler is greatestt such program out there for it's purposeand the issue that continues to be carped about is not all that big a deal in reality.

This is where we disagree. Ignoring the current userbase and not providing any of the support promised to help make the online better is a huge problem. It effects the amount that people will contribute, it effects the value of data (if people have different opinions on the wordings of rules where no "support" has been offered, yet asked), it effects how people feel about Invelos as a company and shows what they think of their current userbase. With the little bit of extra effort, things are more uniform, people are happier, they contrubute more, tell their friends more about the product, equals sales and essentially more money for Invelos and additional people helping their (already outstanding) product better.

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You know years ago I saw a problem in Profiler along with at least one of user and we took it upon ourselves to get in touch and quietly suggest a plan of action, we addressed the issue with Ken's support and backing. That is the only other possibility that I can see, if you believe there is an issue then grab the bull by the horns and wrestle it to the ground. Contact Ken with a suggestion on how as a user could deal with iit.

I have asked via the support system and via contact us. My best reply was, "this has been forwarded, please us contact us in future".

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I will however, warn you, based on my own experience be very prepared to be belittled, attcked and insulted, perhaps even tarred and feathered for taking the initiative, not by Ken or Gerri but by other users.

It's a shame this happens but you have to question why. Is it because the word isn't from Ken and Gerri? Is it the fact they don't bother to chime in, people get frustrated and take it out on others? Who knows. I commend anyone who tries to better this place, but as far as I'm concerned, unless you see any participation from Ken/Gerri, it will never go anywhere.

Sam:

Then keep spinning your wheels and making other miserable becauyse you won't drop it nor are you willing to go on the offensive. I did that, and I think it resulted in a positive change for the Community, and I am very proud of the end result, I am not particularly proud of the community, but I am of what was achieved.

OK, serious question. When I was investigating which program to go to, many of the big DVD sites had threads about the best program, many with 100+ votes. Profiler was the undoubted winner. Please tell me then, with such a large userbase, why despite with a collection of over 5000 releases spreading many regions, I only ever see the same handful of users contributing? It's not because I own releases no-one else does as I have many of the 'big' titles from the localities probably best represented by Profiler (UK and USA). Where are all these users and why don't they contribute? Of course you will always have a lot of users who just can't be bothered and don't use the program to it's full capabilities but what about the rest of the users? Too many rules that can be misinterpreted? Too many rude voters? Gave up because they get pointed to a 4 year old forum post?

If my want for promised support makes you miserable, then that is also the fault of poor support by Invelos. You know where the block button is, feel free to use it.

Quoting samuelrichardscott:

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OK, serious question. When I was investigating which program to go to, many of the big DVD sites had threads about the best program, many with 100+ votes. Profiler was the undoubted winner. Please tell me then, with such a large userbase, why despite with a collection of over 5000 releases spreading many regions, I only ever see the same handful of users contributing? It's not because I own releases no-one else does as I have many of the 'big' titles from the localities probably best represented by Profiler (UK and USA). Where are all these users and why don't they contribute? Of course you will always have a lot of users who just can't be bothered and don't use the program to it's full capabilities but what about the rest of the users? Too many rules that can be misinterpreted? Too many rude voters? Gave up because they get pointed to a 4 year old forum post?

If my want for promised support makes you miserable, then that is also the fault of poor support by Invelos. You know where the block button is, feel free to use it.

Your post actually made me laugh, Sam. You talk about misinterpreting the Rules, you then are willing to hammer and beat up on the person that is in the best position to give the interpretation. All i ever wanted to do was help and developing the Rules was the biggest single user contributed in the history of the program, and we hammered the initial draft out in 90 days...it took teamwork but we did it. I remember one of our chat sessions that was a 15 hour marathon, I had to leave and go to work, but when I came back some of the team was still there hard at it, I was very proud of them that particular day.

As to why don't people don't Contribute more. Unlike you I am not willing to make assumptions which can't be backed up. I will only say that no matter what, the vast majority of users would not be active participants in the Contribution process. Sam I also find the block button to be a childish outlet for someone unwilling to engage in discussion either privately or publicly. I have exactly three users blocked myself and that was because of their foul mouths. So where do you fall on this Sam, but then I can tell you that answer already, I don't have to guess. Now what else might pPMs be good for given the above discussion....hmmm wow I have to think about that one...NOT.

I like Ken Cole and known him for oh 7 or 8 years now, and shared many laughs with him. I still owe him a barbeque...note to self. I have given you the best advice I can analyze the rpoblem, come up with a solution and then work with ken to implement it. I have other thoughts on this but if you think I am going to talk about them publicly you are nuts.

Quoting Winston Smith:

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Your post actually made me laugh, Sam. You talk about misinterpreting the Rules, you then are willing to hammer and beat up on the person that is in the best position to give the interpretation.

Huh? I never 'beat up' on anybody. Who is the person to give the best interpretation? You? Nope. Ken. But he never updates the rules on that rare occassion he does guide us, instead expecting the userbase to know about all these forum posts.

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All i ever wanted to do was help and developing the Rules was the biggest single user contributed in the history of the program, and we hammered the initial draft out in 90 days...it took teamwork but we did it. I remember one of our chat sessions that was a 15 hour marathon, I had to leave and go to work, but when I came back some of the team was still there hard at it, I was very proud of them that particular day.

Congrats, but this has nothing to do with the case in point. You are talking about writing the rules, I am talking about Invelos support. As a side note, I have not once said the rules are rubbish, you have simply twisted my words. Some rules can be interpreted in more than one way, all Ken needs to do is chime in for these instances.

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As to why don't people don't Contribute more. Unlike you I am not willing to make assumptions which can't be backed up.

I never made any assumptions. I asked questions to point out these are definate possibilities.

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I will only say that no matter what, the vast majority of users would not be active participants in the Contribution process.

I agree. It will always be a small %, but surely more than a handful considering the general userbase?

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Sam I also find the block button to be a childish outlet for someone unwilling to engage in discussion either privately or publicly. I have exactly three users blocked myself and that was because of their foul mouths.

All I said was that if you find my posts make you miserable, block them. Please don't twist my words.

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So where do you fall on this Sam, but then I can tell you that answer already, I don't have to guess. Now what else might pPMs be good for given the above discussion....hmmm wow I have to think about that one...NOT.

You've lost me here sweetheart. Please let me know what you're talking about now. The answer to what? Where do I fall on what issue?

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I like Ken Cole and known him for oh 7 or 8 years now, and shared many laughs with him. I still owe him a barbeque...note to self. I have given you the best advice I can analyze the rpoblem, come up with a solution and then work with ken to implement it. I have other thoughts on this but if you think I am going to talk about them publicly you are nuts.

You have given me good advice here. I will now analyze the problem (lack of Invelos support). Come up with a solution (ask Invelos to be more involved with the current userbase). Implement it (that would be down to Invelos).