Quoting apltm:

Quote:
Recently I've seen a lot of cast changes adding group dividers where it is clear, especially when looking at the actual credits, that the submitter has not checked the credits and just added group dividers wherever it seems to fit.

Yeah, I know wich user you're talking about...  Unfortunately, most people happily vote "yes" to just about anything.

That wasn't my point surfeur51.
I'm quite happy for people to add group dividers, I would just like it if they used the actual credits to do it.

Personally I find it a nice feature, but I would like it if they could be nested. As it is now sometimes compromise is necessary to reflect the credits.

Quoting apltm:

Quote:
Recently I've seen a lot of cast changes adding group dividers where it is clear, especially when looking at the actual credits, that the submitter has not checked the credits and just added group dividers wherever it seems to fit.

I would urge everyone to look closely at contributions where only dividers are added to see if the change is indeed valid.

I always say that I have seen these group dividers in the closing credits whenever I have submitted changes for that very reason.

Something like 'group divders as seen in closing credits'...

I've had to change several Cast listings back where someone has incorrectly assumed group dividers where needed (and not actually there) in the credit block. 

Quoting KinoNiki:

Quote:
I have a question regarding episode dividers: Recently someone changed the episode dividers used in Night on Earth to group dividers (for no reason stated, other than that they were "new"). This is an episodic film that takes place in different locations around the world, so it's not a question of group roles. The episodes are more like short films. The rules state that:

Quote:
Use Episode dividers for TV show episodes, distinct films, or other logical episodic distinction. Also use episode dividers for full cast division, such as "Japanese Voices".

So was the change correct? In my opinion it was incorrect, episode dividers should still be used for cases like this.

I changed them to group dividers because it may be episodic, but it's still one film - not several films, not episodes, but one film.  That's why.

The way I understand the usage of the episode dividers is to divide either TV episodes, separate short or full-length films on single-sided discs, or cast separations as in anime English & Japanese voice casts. 

If I'm wrong with Night on Earth, I'll happily change it back.  I just wanted to give the reason I changed it - that being that it was one film, rather than separate films.

Also, with Night on Earth I added the costume & make-up credits, which I did with group dividers as well, since they were divided that way.  But the rest of the crew applies to the whole film.  If we were to divide the cast with episode dividers, it would only make sense that the crew should be divided that way as well.  But there's a single set of crew with only the costume & make-up people (as far as people we track) being grouped.  So would we have 5 episode dividers in crew as well, with the same crew repeated and only the costume & make-up changing?

For episodic films (e.g. short films/stories edited into and/or distributed as one film, films divided into periods or locations) I use episode dividers when the cast is divided per short/period. For example:
- Black Sabbath or I tre volti della paura (1963) and Tales of Terror (1962). The cast credits are divided by a logical episodic distinction, namely by three short stories (both films consist of three different stories or short films if you like).
- The Hours (2002) in which the cast is divided between three time periods.
- Things You Can Tell by Just Looking at Her (2000), scene dividers.

I think that when the cast divider isn't part of a role it can be considered an episode divider.

Even for anthology films, I had the impression that you were to use group dividers rather than episode dividers.  Night on Earth, the film KinoNiki is talking about, is an anthology film.

For example, if you look at the profile for Tales of Terror (this disc ID: I58FB6F307EA8E9FF, don't know about other profiles), where the cast for each story in the anthology is divided with group dividers.  But there is a single crew list for the whole film.

I think we really need some clarification as to where Ken wants to go with this ... but good luck for us getting it.

I am not 100% sure I agree with the story aspect of an anthology movie... which is why I said maybe. But I definitely do not agree that location name or time period shows "logical episodic distinction." To me they definitely scream group divider.

I think this is something Ken  really needs to clarify more in the rules.