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| Registered: May 26, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 2,878 |
| | Posted: | | | | I just picked up a box at Big Lots containing the film Hollywood Canteen. It has two credits I am curious as to how they should be recorded:
A: Andrews Sisters
Currently, the credits are recorded in the profile as:
LaVerne Andrews [Andrews Sisters]
Maxene Andrews [Andrews Sisters]
Patty Andrews [Andrews Sisters]
I do not believe this is the correct way to do this. I will be changing the credits to:
The Andrews Sisters [Andrews Sisters]
I have never seen a musical group with a name such as The Andrews Sisters broken up this way in the profile credits before. I have always seen the group name recorded if that is the way the group is credited. Opinions?
B: Jimmy Dorsey and His Band, Carmen Cavallaro and His Orchestra, etc.
I say etc. because I have a number of movies with credits like these. This is by no means unique. How should these be credited?
1. Jimmy Dorsey [Jimmy Dorsey and His Band]
Carmen Cavallaro [Carmen Cavallaro and His Orchestra]
2. Jimmy Dorsey and His Band
Carmen Cavallaro and His Orchestra
3. Jimmy Dorsey
Jimmy Dorsey's Band [and His Band]
Carmen Cavallaro
Carmen Cavallaro's Orchestra [and His Orchestra]
4. something else (please elaborate)
#1 is how they are currently credited in the profile. Again, I am not sure this is correct. I personally prefer #3, but, again, I am not sure this is how they should be credited. I think #2 might be correct.
Any opinions appreciated! I'm definitely going to change The Andrews Sisters credit, but I'm open on how to do the second if everyone agrees with me about The Andrews Sisters (if you don't, I'll just keep my changes local). | | | If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world.
-- Thorin Oakenshield |
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| Registered: March 20, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 2,850 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Danae Cassandra: Quote:
Currently, the credits are recorded in the profile as:
LaVerne Andrews [Andrews Sisters]
Maxene Andrews [Andrews Sisters]
Patty Andrews [Andrews Sisters]
I do not believe this is the correct way to do this. I will be changing the credits to:
The Andrews Sisters [Andrews Sisters] I'd prefer to credit individuals rather than teams, especially when those people aren't always credited as a team. And even if credited as a team ("The Andrews Sisters") there are reasons why you might want to credit them individually. Take this credit for instance:  Here "The Andrews Sisters" are credited with three roles. It makes sense in a case like this to credit each performer and use Credited As for "The Andrews Sisters". And if we can do it in this case, why can't we do it for any film where we know who "The Andrews Sisters" are? --------------- |
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| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  | | Posts: 13,201 |
| | Posted: | | | | The most common credit should be used in this case just like every other case. If they are most often credited as 'Andrew Sisters', then that is what should be used. If it is 'The Andrew Sisters', then that is what should be used. If it is the individual name, then that is what should be used. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar | | | | Last edited: by TheMadMartian |
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| Registered: January 1, 2009 | | Reputation: |  Posts: 3,087 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
The most common credit should be used in this case just like every other case. If they are most often credited as 'Andrew Sisters', then that is what should be used. If it is 'The Andrew Sisters', then that is what should be used. If it is the individual name, then that is what should be used. That's what I also think, but on the B part of the question I'm unsure. I don't know if "Jimmy Dorsey and His Band" could be separated in a useful way. |
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  | Corne | | Registered: Nov. 1, 2000 |
| Registered: April 5, 2007 |  Posts: 1,059 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting VirusPil: Quote:
Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
The most common credit should be used in this case just like every other case. If they are most often credited as 'Andrew Sisters', then that is what should be used. If it is 'The Andrew Sisters', then that is what should be used. If it is the individual name, then that is what should be used.
That's what I also think, but on the B part of the question I'm unsure.
I don't know if "Jimmy Dorsey and His Band" could be separated in a useful way. Indeed "Jimmy Dorsey and His Band" won't fit in the first name field and I think that it's a reasonable solution adding it as "Jimmy Dorsey [Jimmy Dorsey and His Band]". | | | | Cor |
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| Corne | | Registered: Nov. 1, 2000 |
| Registered: April 5, 2007 | | Posts: 1,059 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
The most common credit should be used in this case just like every other case. If they are most often credited as 'Andrew Sisters', then that is what should be used. If it is 'The Andrew Sisters', then that is what should be used. If it is the individual name, then that is what should be used. Agreed, the only exception would be when the group name doesn't fit into the first name field then I'm in for the 'credited as' solution. | | | | Cor |
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| Registered: May 26, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 2,878 |
| | Posted: | | | | Separating the credit for The Andrews Sisters, in this case, does not reflect the credits on screen. Since we are repeatedly told to reflect screen credits as much as possible...
In other words, the screen credits are:
Andrews Sisters
Jack Benny
Joe E. Brown
etc.
Separating the sisters gives us this list:
Andrews Sisters
Andrews Sisters
Andrews Sisters
Jack Benny
Joe E. Brown
etc.
Yet, separating the credits is not done evenly throughout the profile. Later we have this credit:
Roy Rogers [Roy Rogers & Trigger]
If we're separating credits, shouldn't this be:
Roy Rogers
Trigger
Unlike "and His Band" or "and His Orchestra" where this is done, Trigger is a separate single individual who has lots of individual credits. | | | If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world.
-- Thorin Oakenshield |
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| T!M | | Profiling since Dec. 2000 |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 8,733 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Danae Cassandra: Quote:
Trigger is a separate single individual who has lots of individual credits. As such, he should indeed be given a separate cast credit. |
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| Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Posts: 1,777 |
| | Posted: | | | | Do it however you feel best follows the rules. As one of the possibly affected users, I can assure you that whatever you do I'll change as necessary to match my way of doing things. I wouldn't worry too much about it. |
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| Corne | | Registered: Nov. 1, 2000 |
| Registered: April 5, 2007 | | Posts: 1,059 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting T!M: Quote:
Quoting Danae Cassandra:
Quote:
Trigger is a separate single individual who has lots of individual credits.
As such, he should indeed be given a separate cast credit. I agree. | | | | Cor |
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| Registered: May 8, 2007 | | Posts: 663 |
| | Posted: | | | | Why not use a group divider? If this movie was released today I'm sure that is how they would have credited the group, instead of using the brackets. So it would look something like this:
The Andrews Sisters <--- Group Divider
LaVerne Andrews
Maxene Andrews
Patty Andrews | | | We're on a mission from God.
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| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 4,506 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Mighty Mike: Quote:
Why not use a group divider? If this movie was released today I'm sure that is how they would have credited the group, instead of using the brackets. So it would look something like this:
The Andrews Sisters <--- Group Divider
LaVerne Andrews
Maxene Andrews
Patty Andrews I like this idea..... | | | | Registered: July 7 2000 |
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| Registered: May 26, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 2,878 |
| | Posted: | | | | The screen cap above with the bracket divider is from a different movie. If it were from this film, I would fully support that idea.
The credits for Hollywood Canteen simply read "Andrews Sisters" - they are not broken down in the credits. | | | If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world.
-- Thorin Oakenshield | | | | Last edited: by Danae Cassandra |
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| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  | | Posts: 6,635 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Danae Cassandra: Quote:
The screen cap above with the bracket divider is from a different movie. If it were from this film, I would fully support that idea.
The credits for Hollywood Canteen simply read "Andrews Sisters" - they are not broken down in the credits. I would enter this credit: The Andrews Sisters// [Andrews Sisters] as Themselves The Jimmy Dorsey and His Band credit should go in as: Jimmy Dorsey and His Band// as Themselves | | | | Hal | | | | Last edited: by hal9g |
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| Registered: October 6, 2008 | | Posts: 1,932 |
| | Posted: | | | | I think that if the individuals are identified or identifiable, the most useful expression of the data is that they be individually listed. For leaders and their bands, I would list the bandleader with his own name, and then the band under the group name:
Jimmy Dorsey and His Band would be
Jimmy Dorsey as Himself
Jimmy Dorsey and His Band as Themselves
(since "and His Band" would not be a useful credit, as has been pointed out before)
If someone has the knowledge to identify another band member, he/she could be added as
Sammy Soloist [Jimmy Dorsey and His Band] as Himself
Doing the credits this way would make their handling consistent with credits like Abbott and Costello, etc. which I don't think anyone would argue should not be broken out to individual credits. |
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| Corne | | Registered: Nov. 1, 2000 |
| Registered: April 5, 2007 | | Posts: 1,059 |
| | Posted: | | | | The only problem is that "Jimmy Dorsey and His Band" probably won't fit into the first name field so that in mind I would say something like:
Jimmy Dorsey as Himself
Jimmy Dorsey [Jimmy Dorsey and His Band] as Themselves | | | | Cor |
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