Welcome to the Invelos forums. Please read the forum rules before posting.

Read access to our public forums is open to everyone. To post messages, a free registration is required.

If you have an Invelos account, sign in to post.

    Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion Page: 1 2 3  Previous   Next
"Body Make-up"
Author Message
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorT!M
Profiling since Dec. 2000
Registered: March 13, 2007
Reputation: Highest Rating
Netherlands Posts: 8,665
Posted:
PM this userDirect link to this postReply with quote
Simple question: does a "Body Make-up" credit qualify for a "Make-up Artist" entry, or for a "Make-up Effects" entry, or for no entry at all?
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorAiAustria
Profiling since 2004
Registered: May 19, 2007
Reputation: Highest Rating
Austria Posts: 5,703
Posted:
PM this userDirect link to this postReply with quote
I voted for Make-up effects, because most of the times body makeup is effects makeup - except for adult movies 
Complete list of Common Names  •  A good point for starting with Headshots (and v11.1)
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorMikaLove
Knowledge is Power
Registered: May 2, 2009
Reputation: High Rating
Posts: 490
Posted:
PM this userVisit this user's homepageView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
I need more info. What title are we talking about and how do the credits look besides this...?

I must say I don't think I have seen this credit before, so because it sounded so weird to me I voted that it shouldn't be entered.
Trying to Google it didn't work so well.
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar Contributormreeder50
I was outta bullets
Registered: March 29, 2007
Reputation: Superior Rating
United States Posts: 2,713
Posted:
PM this userEmail this userView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
Quoting AiAustria:
Quote:
I voted for Make-up effects, because most of the times body makeup is effects makeup - except for adult movies 

I voted the same way.
Marty - Registered July 10, 2004, User since 2002.
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorTheMadMartian
Alien with an attitude
Registered: March 13, 2007
Reputation: Highest Rating
United States Posts: 13,198
Posted:
PM this userEmail this userView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
For what it's worth:

What is a Body Makeup Artist & what role do they perform on set?

After reading that, I voted "Make-up Artist'
No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar
 Last edited: by TheMadMartian
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorObiKen
Registered: October 22, 2015
Reputation: Superior Rating
Australia Posts: 257
Posted:
PM this userDirect link to this postReply with quote
The work and responsibilities of a movie makeup artist are constrained by film production contracts and union rules.

A movie makeup artist applies cosmetics from the top of the head to the top of the breastbone, from fingertips to wrists and from toes to ankles. A movie body makeup artist applies cosmetics to any area of the body that a regular movie makeup artist cannot:
https://entertainment.howstuffworks.com/movie-make-up-artist1.htm

On the other hand, Makeup Effects is makeup including the application of prosthetics to the performers face and/or body.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorMikaLove
Knowledge is Power
Registered: May 2, 2009
Reputation: High Rating
Posts: 490
Posted:
PM this userVisit this user's homepageView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
We also have to consider what the credits rules say, and what they include for respective credit (Make-up Artist vs. Make-up Effects).

Reading what it says on the site TheMadMartian linked, it rather clearly defines the difference between what a Make-up Artist does and does not, but what a body makeup do. In this sense, a body makeup credit should not be entered as Make-Up Artist, because that would be wrong.

I specifically quote:
Quote:
Body makeup artists work on areas of the body other than the face to apply many of the same makeup products that a standard makeup artist would use but they may also apply latex or other cosmetics to the body.


So, ultimately, I say the only valid credit for a body makeup one is as Make-up Effects.
 Last edited: by MikaLove
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorNosferatu
Registered: March 24, 2007
Reputation: Highest Rating
United Kingdom Posts: 1,204
Posted:
PM this userView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
Quoting ObiKen:
Quote:
The work and responsibilities of a movie makeup artist are constrained by film production contracts and union rules.

A movie makeup artist applies cosmetics from the top of the head to the top of the breastbone, from fingertips to wrists and from toes to ankles. A movie body makeup artist applies cosmetics to any area of the body that a regular movie makeup artist cannot:
https://entertainment.howstuffworks.com/movie-make-up-artist1.htm

On the other hand, Makeup Effects is makeup including the application of prosthetics to the performers face and/or body.

That seems fairly straightforward: make-up is make-up, regardless of which cheeks it's being applied to! The only question is the extent and intent of the make-up and what is said in the credits.

If someone is applying make-up, I'd classify them as a make-up artist. If they are credited as doing make-up effects or special effects make-up, then that would be the other category.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorMikaLove
Knowledge is Power
Registered: May 2, 2009
Reputation: High Rating
Posts: 490
Posted:
PM this userVisit this user's homepageView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
I disagree with the above.

Again, in the text TheMadMartian linked, it explicitly says that a Make-Up Artist deals with the head (and hands and feet) of an actor/extra/whatever, but a Body Make-Up artist does more than that. This is what ObiKen said – and nothing else (I think it's rude to misquote someone). A Body Make-Up artist do the special make-up that is not involved in the job or is allowed per the union rules for a regular Make-Up Artist.

So it's irrelevant how, when or where the credit "Body Make-Up" appears in any feature.

Again, we are all bound to abide by the contribution rules;
Make-up Artist
Basically all credits here point to the head and around it.

Make-up Effects
The definitions of credits here don't list a "Body Make-Up" credit per se, but they do indicate that it's other than the make-up for a cast member's head but also another kind of make-up.
I.e.;
Quote:
Make-up Effects,
Special Make-up Effects [by]
Prosthetic Make-Up


Another quote to help differ between the both and that one has to do more about head make-up and the other about desired bodily effects;
Quote:
Body makeup artists work on areas of the body other than the face to apply many of the same makeup products that a standard makeup artist would use but they may also apply latex or other cosmetics to the body.


The underlined part here completely suggests to me that we're talking about Make-Up Effects.
Otherwise this category of credit would lose its meaning, and "everything" would plain and simply be "make-up".
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
Registered: March 20, 2007
Reputation: Great Rating
United States Posts: 2,845
Posted:
PM this userView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
Quoting MikaLove:
Quote:
I disagree with the above.

I disagree with you.  A body makeup artist may be doing something as simple as covering a tattoo, and I don't consider that a makeup effect.

---------------
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorMikaLove
Knowledge is Power
Registered: May 2, 2009
Reputation: High Rating
Posts: 490
Posted:
PM this userVisit this user's homepageView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
Quoting scotthm:
Quote:
Quoting MikaLove:
Quote:
I disagree with the above.

I disagree with you.  A body makeup artist may be doing something as simple as covering a tattoo, and I don't consider that a makeup effect.

---------------


To try and make it absolutely clear, look again at the rules here: they differ between head (make-up) and rest of body (effects).
That's absolutely how I understand it and it's how the website explains it.
We don't have that much room to debate it, because of how our rules and the profession are being defined (and not by me).
If a body make-up artist happens to cover a scar, their profession is still not that of a make-up artist and here we don't define them as such either.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
Registered: March 20, 2007
Reputation: Great Rating
United States Posts: 2,845
Posted:
PM this userView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
Quoting MikaLove:
Quote:
To try and make it absolutely clear, look again at the rules here: they differ between head (make-up) and rest of body (effects).

I don't see a distinction between head and body in the Invelos crew table.

---------------
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar Contributormreeder50
I was outta bullets
Registered: March 29, 2007
Reputation: Superior Rating
United States Posts: 2,713
Posted:
PM this userEmail this userView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
Based on what I have read here from the links, I have changed my vote to "shouldn't be entered at all". Body Makeup is not one of the credits that we track. Would I like to track it, yes, but until it's qualified...I'm out.
Marty - Registered July 10, 2004, User since 2002.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorMikaLove
Knowledge is Power
Registered: May 2, 2009
Reputation: High Rating
Posts: 490
Posted:
PM this userVisit this user's homepageView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
Quoting scotthm:
Quote:
Quoting MikaLove:
Quote:
To try and make it absolutely clear, look again at the rules here: they differ between head (make-up) and rest of body (effects).

I don't see a distinction between head and body in the Invelos crew table.

---------------

Put two and two together?

It's definitely there. And there and there.

Quoting mreeder50:
Quote:
Based on what I have read here from the links, I have changed my vote to "shouldn't be entered at all". Body Makeup is not one of the credits that we track. Would I like to track it, yes, but until it's qualified...I'm out.

Yeah. Since we can't seem to agree here, for whatever reason ( ) and IMO despite it's all laid up in front of us, at the very least a body make-up credit is better to be agreed should not be entered at all than to willingly, erroneously be entered as Make-Up Artist.
I'd go to great lengths to make such contributions be declined.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
Registered: March 20, 2007
Reputation: Great Rating
United States Posts: 2,845
Posted:
PM this userView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
Quoting MikaLove:
Quote:
Put two and two together?

You do realize that "head make-up artist" means "principal" make-up artist and not "head" make-up artist?

---------------
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorNosferatu
Registered: March 24, 2007
Reputation: Highest Rating
United Kingdom Posts: 1,204
Posted:
PM this userView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
Quoting MikaLove:
Quote:
I disagree with the above.

Again, in the text TheMadMartian linked, it explicitly says that a Make-Up Artist deals with the head (and hands and feet) of an actor/extra/whatever, but a Body Make-Up artist does more than that. This is what ObiKen said – and nothing else (I think it's rude to misquote someone). A Body Make-Up artist do the special make-up that is not involved in the job or is allowed per the union rules for a regular Make-Up Artist.

So it's irrelevant how, when or where the credit "Body Make-Up" appears in any feature.

Again, we are all bound to abide by the contribution rules;
Make-up Artist
Basically all credits here point to the head and around it.

Make-up Effects
The definitions of credits here don't list a "Body Make-Up" credit per se, but they do indicate that it's other than the make-up for a cast member's head but also another kind of make-up.
I.e.;
Quote:
Make-up Effects,
Special Make-up Effects [by]
Prosthetic Make-Up


Another quote to help differ between the both and that one has to do more about head make-up and the other about desired bodily effects;
Quote:
Body makeup artists work on areas of the body other than the face to apply many of the same makeup products that a standard makeup artist would use but they may also apply latex or other cosmetics to the body.


The underlined part here completely suggests to me that we're talking about Make-Up Effects.
Otherwise this category of credit would lose its meaning, and "everything" would plain and simply be "make-up".

The same website says:
Quote:
Some body makeup artists also skilled in special effects makeup, and are responsible for applying physical features such as a sternum, added limbs, or other features of the body that a character may not naturally already have.

This means some of the artists applying make-up to people's bodies are make-up artists and others are in the category of special effects make-up. There is clearly a distinction.
    Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion Page: 1 2 3  Previous   Next